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TOPIC: Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different

RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:04 #91

  • Gary Hill
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Maybe the magic word is compression instead of expansion? When the whole weight of an equine is dissapated over the whole area of a hoof, somethings going to move to absorb the shock?? Minute as it may be???:confused:
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:06 #92

Gary, in my opinion the best choice for glueon is sigafoos. The thick blue rim pad allow the heels to move. I also cut away the fabric in the heels at an angle with my handy dandy Kevlar shears so the cuff does not extent all the way back onto the heels. I ate a pair of sigafoos glueons last week because they came off too soon. My fault for not making sure the feet were dry.
Phil Armitage, CF
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"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:07 #93

Gary Hill wrote:
Maybe the magic word is compression instead of expansion? When the whole weight of an equine is dissapated over the whole area of a hoof, somethings going to move to absorb the shock?? Minute as it may be???:confused:

I agree, maybe.
Phil Armitage, CF
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"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:09 #94

  • Gary Hill
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My clients are too cheap for glue ons!! But we have pretty good feet around my area??
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:10 #95

reillyshoe wrote:
The point of this thread is that there is a difference- for good or bad.

Early on I worried about it being bad. The study does not glueon shoes like Sigafoos. After using Sigafoos for many years now, I see they are not bad.
Phil Armitage, CF
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"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:11 #96

  • Rick Burten
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Phil Armitage wrote:
Ok, in my opinion heel movement is over analysed and given way too much importance.
Interesting hypothesis. Care to elaborate?
Imperical data has shown me depth or the lack of it and medial/lateral balance is much more important in soundness.
Please provide some links/bibliography for this empirical data.
Horses with low heels and very little sole depth expose the coffin bone wings and sole corrium to trauma.
How about horses with high heels and very little sole depth?
Trimming and shoeing to obtain depth and protect the bottom of the coffin bone has worked well for me and in most cases this can be achieved with getting the hoof into the proper shape and good shoeing.
What about horses that have reached the genetic potential for sole depth and that depth is spartan(ie: < 8-10mm) at best? What is your trimming/shoeing protocol(s)? Please elaborate on what constitutes 'proper hoof shape' and how that is [universally] determined.
Simple principle, however difficult to achieve the skills.
Upon due consideration, I find the principle is not so simple. YMMV.
Rick Burten PF

In the immortal words of Ron White: "But let me tell you something, folks: You can't fix S-tupid. There's not a pill you can take; there's not a class you can go to. S-tupid is forever."
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Je pense donc je suis
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:11 #97

  • Gary Hill
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Best example I can remember seeing was I think in Bro Baron very first Online Conferance? I think it was Mitch Taylor had the cadiver leg and a hold drilled into the hoof to see the coffin bone sink upon compression??
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:13 #98

reillyshoe wrote:
Gary,
Some people just post to argue.:)

It can all be taken as argument. If we all agree then very little will be written on here. :)
Phil Armitage, CF
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:15 #99

  • Gary Hill
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Phil, I THINK maybe the point is that we all see ugly feet that are sound and pretty "perfect" feet lame as can be?? I may be off base but thats how I callem behind the plate! Batter UP!:D
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:16 #100

Rick Burten wrote:
Interesting hypothesis. Care to elaborate?

Please provide some links/bibliography for this empirical data.

How about horses with high heels and very little sole depth?

What about horses that have reached the genetic potential for sole depth and that depth is spartan(ie: < 8-10mm) at best? What is your trimming/shoeing protocol(s)? Please elaborate on what constitutes 'proper hoof shape' and how that is [universally] determined.

Upon due consideration, I find the principle is not so simple. YMMV.

This is good stuff Rick. Perfect outline for a good hands on clinic.
Phil Armitage, CF
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"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:17 #101

  • Rick Burten
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Phil Armitage wrote:
If we all agree then very little will be written on here. :)
Which begs the question, why are you trying to bust my/Pat's, et al, chops? :confused:
Rick Burten PF

In the immortal words of Ron White: "But let me tell you something, folks: You can't fix S-tupid. There's not a pill you can take; there's not a class you can go to. S-tupid is forever."
."


Je pense donc je suis
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:20 #102

Gary Hill wrote:
Phil, I THINK maybe the point is that we all see ugly feet that are sound and pretty "perfect" feet lame as can be?? I may be off base but thats how I callem behind the plate! Batter UP!:D

I do to and a lot of those ugly feet have mass and some of those nice looking feet lack mass. We can still maintain mass and make it look good though. :)
Phil Armitage, CF
AFA member 7480

"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 04:24 #103

Rick Burten wrote:
Which begs the question, why are you trying to bust my/Pat's, et al, chops? :confused:

Seems to be the only way to get a response on here and I saw the Doc was getting ganged up. Seems like when blood is drawn on here all the sharks like to show up and feed. Has not changed much on here.
Phil Armitage, CF
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"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 07:51 #104

  • Travis Reed
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Phil Armitage wrote:
What part did you enjoy?

The most interesting part to me was the soft tissue being picked up on radiographs...this came up while working with a vet 2 weeks ago...last week this came up by me to another vet and they had very diff feelings....now it has come up on here ..wonderind why all the sudden this keeps poping up..maybe new info ..I don't know...one vet had the views of Dr Sam the other vet leaned to the side of not thinking it was a good way to map as felt it was hit and miss...or one could miss read structures do to the burn out phase...as I said way out of my pay grade ...so was bit disapointed when Doc Sam felt he was getting to many hard questions and advised anyone who wanted to know more could order the info or attend the clinic as he did not have the time.....after all I quess we just a bunch of po dunk farrier who could not understand what he was talking about therefore he no longer had the time...how dare one challange the theroy of a vet guess we should just blinfold and follow all the way to slaughter..how dare rick have a diff opinoin......its funny how one gets the idea because one presses for info they must be sharks..:rolleyes::rolleyes:
Travis Reed.....


www.sporthorsefarrier.com to direct link..
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RE:Heel movement in horses: comparison between glued and nailed horse shoes at different 07 Jun 2011 07:57 #105

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So brings me to ask why is this question of soft tissues popping up so reg at this time...maybe a new thread would be in order..
Travis Reed.....


www.sporthorsefarrier.com to direct link..
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