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TOPIC: Base Narrow, Toed Out?

Base Narrow, Toed Out? 23 May 2011 16:19 #1

  • MPLdyCop
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Ok this is my Stud I just shod the fronts yesterday. He is not walking well today. Seems he's winging in but not striking the other leg, just seems close. Today he is not wanting to walk around much. Checked the usual. Cleaned out the feet, hoof testers on the hooves, palpating the joints and rotating some. All no signs of pain. He is dragging the toe on his right front, picks up his left just fine. He's not head bobbing, just dragging the right front and it's obvious he's not wanting to walk a lot. He has always greeted me. It's not the skewed shod foot (LF) that he seems to be favoring. :confused:

This is a square as I could get him to stand. I've not noticed the toe out to this extent before, and fear maybe I should have done a toe correction on him. Other thought is that during the trim he had little toe growth and a lot of heel. Could he be sore in the DDFT from lowering the heels?

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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 23 May 2011 16:49 #2

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After further investigation I found this.



In case it's not apparent, it's a sizable swelling right there.

Teaches me to just look at the bottom half of the horse. I mentioned that he was fighting me so after the skewed shoe and me about to give out, I gave him some Rompun. Never used that before and apparently he had a reaction? I've used Ace on him before and didn't see that.

Just so happens it's the side of the dragged toe. I noticed finally when I walked him to water and he was hesitating to lean down and drink. I had just been watching his feet. :o
Kim Turner

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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 23 May 2011 16:51 #3

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Thoughts on the conformation will still be appreciated. :)
Kim Turner

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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 23 May 2011 17:00 #4

  • Jack Evers
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Breed, age, appears to be young, do you plan to keep him as a stud? I wouldn't. To me base narrow, toed out is a serious fault.
Jack Evers CJF AFA#426

The best things about the good old days -- I wasn't good and I wasn't old.

The older I get, the more horses I shoe, the fewer things that I can absolutely, positively fix.
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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 23 May 2011 17:18 #5

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Jack Evers wrote:
Breed, age, appears to be young, do you plan to keep him as a stud? I wouldn't. To me base narrow, toed out is a serious fault.

QH, 7 yrs, I did want to keep him a stud because I love his head. Small ears, etc. Not all blocky. Hmm I already thought he was a bit longer in the body than I preferred. So that is a high chance of passing along? I just wanted one baby off him.
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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 23 May 2011 17:58 #6

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MPLdyCop wrote:
QH, 7 yrs, I did want to keep him a stud because I love his head. Small ears, etc. Not all blocky. Hmm I already thought he was a bit longer in the body than I preferred. So that is a high chance of passing along? I just wanted one baby off him.

I've given that one chance to a couple mares I liked and it worked out OK, but he's seven now, if you use him at eight and decide at 10 when the baby is a yearling, that you don't like the baby, you're looking at gelding a very mature stallion, which I've also done W/O problem, but it has it's risks.

I raised QH for twenty years, I've seen a lot of that base narrow, toed out. In the show ring, winging in is less noticeable than paddling out so some folks prefer it to pigeon-toed, but I saw a lot more leg problems with the BNTO on hard working horses. Maturity and muscle sometimes rotate the legs inward, but at seven "what you see is what you get" It may be the picture or the footing, but the knees also seem to not line up. Limb length disparity? Sorry to be blunt, but to me - not stud material.
Jack Evers CJF AFA#426

The best things about the good old days -- I wasn't good and I wasn't old.

The older I get, the more horses I shoe, the fewer things that I can absolutely, positively fix.
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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 23 May 2011 20:25 #7

  • Clint Burrell
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MPLdyCop wrote:
After further investigation I found this.



In case it's not apparent, it's a sizable swelling right there.

Teaches me to just look at the bottom half of the horse. I mentioned that he was fighting me so after the skewed shoe and me about to give out, I gave him some Rompun. Never used that before and apparently he had a reaction? I've used Ace on him before and didn't see that.

Just so happens it's the side of the dragged toe. I noticed finally when I walked him to water and he was hesitating to lean down and drink. I had just been watching his feet. :o

Go to drugs.com and search rompum/zylazine. Beware of using things you don't fully know about.;) May also want to use some compress' on that swelling, or better yet, call your vet and ask them. Talk to them often and hang out at their office when your not doing anything. There may be a few things there you can pick-up.:cool:
Clint Burrell

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but you don't seem to bright.
You just brought a swichblade
to a pistol fight"
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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 24 May 2011 01:01 #8

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Jack Evers wrote:
I've given that one chance to a couple mares I liked and it worked out OK, but he's seven now, if you use him at eight and decide at 10 when the baby is a yearling, that you don't like the baby, you're looking at gelding a very mature stallion, which I've also done W/O problem, but it has it's risks.

I raised QH for twenty years, I've seen a lot of that base narrow, toed out. In the show ring, winging in is less noticeable than paddling out so some folks prefer it to pigeon-toed, but I saw a lot more leg problems with the BNTO on hard working horses. Maturity and muscle sometimes rotate the legs inward, but at seven "what you see is what you get" It may be the picture or the footing, but the knees also seem to not line up. Limb length disparity? Sorry to be blunt, but to me - not stud material.

if I gotta be blunt, i might aswell quote Jack:D

pretty heads n ears are not nearly as heredible as leg conformation
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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 24 May 2011 01:17 #9

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Is it any wonder, as to why the latest generation of the domestic equine has the amount of issues it has, when the size of ears are the most important criteria for reproduction.
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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 24 May 2011 01:31 #10

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Clint Burrell wrote:
Go to drugs.com and search rompum/zylazine. Beware of using things you don't fully know about.;) May also want to use some compress' on that swelling, or better yet, call your vet and ask them. Talk to them often and hang out at their office when your not doing anything. There may be a few things there you can pick-up.:cool:

My vet gave me the rompum for the original puncture wound, and I didn't need it then. Did just as he said and this happened. So just like people some horses react. I'm just saying it's better it's my own and I'm not sued. He's gonna be ok. He'll just never get rompum again.
Kim Turner

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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 24 May 2011 01:33 #11

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brian robertson wrote:
Is it any wonder, as to why the latest generation of the domestic equine has the amount of issues it has, when the size of ears are the most important criteria for reproduction.

Comes from lack of understanding the way the anatomy effects function. I'll admit I bought the horse for his looks and now understand he isn't conformationally sound.

Education is priceless. Don't assume I overlooked the other and just wanted "pretty ears"

He's going to get cut now. Unless there are health reasons not too, I'm not worried about the "stud" attitude. He isn't that bad, I just need to put more time into him. Suppose he'll make a pretty Gelding.
Kim Turner

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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 24 May 2011 01:53 #12

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Are you sure that the problem is with the drug and not with the administration of the drug?

Maybe it's just the picture but it looks like it was given in the shoulder. While I'll admit I've never given rompum I've not seen any drugs that were meant to be given in the shoulder.

Like I said, maybe I'm wrong but that's what the picture looks like to me.

David
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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 24 May 2011 01:56 #13

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It's in the neck forward of the shoulder, but the swelling is into the shoulder area. It's possible the meds got somewhere they shouldn't I'm sure, but I've given Ace and no problem. At this point I can only speculate.
Kim Turner

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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 24 May 2011 02:03 #14

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MPLdyCop wrote:
It's in the neck forward of the shoulder, but the swelling is into the shoulder area. It's possible the meds got somewhere they shouldn't I'm sure, but I've given Ace and no problem. At this point I can only speculate.

didn't mean to insinuate anything but I don't know what you don't know so, I had to ask.

david
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RE:Base Narrow, Toed Out? 24 May 2011 02:43 #15

  • Jack Evers
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I'm curious why you went IM. I suspect you've had enough EMT type training that IV wouldn't be a problem.
Jack Evers CJF AFA#426

The best things about the good old days -- I wasn't good and I wasn't old.

The older I get, the more horses I shoe, the fewer things that I can absolutely, positively fix.
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