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TOPIC: Heel Fit and Lenth

Heel Fit and Lenth 28 Mar 2010 16:37 #1

  • smitty88
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Just thought i would open a new thread
this question gets asked alot to me

how much lenth do you like to fit with
i know your next answer

it depends on what the horses are doing
point taken

but you must all set out everyday
with a lenth in mind

just an ect i have seen farriers giving horses width
but not enough lenth IMO lately

what you think
Smitty88
John Mc Loughlin
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 28 Mar 2010 16:42 #2

  • tbloomer
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Drop a plumb line from the place where the point of the heel buttress (the origination of horn growth) starts in the coronary band. That's pretty much where I start my base of support.
Tom Bloomer
http://blackburnforge.com
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Here's the deal. I'm trying to keep it simple.
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 28 Mar 2010 18:57 #3

  • solidrockshoer
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I like to fit where possible with heel length, and for where the shoe terminates to bisect the center of the fetlock if a vertical line was dropped down. This works for a variety of lower limb conformation. Unless the horse is doing fast work such as hunting and the shoe is fitted penny on a penny
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 28 Mar 2010 21:52 #4

  • Anthony_Lawrence
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This is a bone of contention with me. :(

1/ Horse owners here in NZ are not educated to seeing proper heel support. I am virtually alone in advocating it in my area. But it is seen a "not normal/shoe too big"

2/ Almost 100% of riding horses (and even many racehorses) are kept in paddocks, often with other horses, come rain, hail or shine. Consequently they will step them off frequently.

3/ Fencing is mostly wire, so those that aren't stepped off end up hanging on a fence.

4/ Most of the hoofbutchers around here will shoe them short so they don't have to keep going back to put shoes on. Because they stay on for 8 weeks "they have put them on well". :mad::mad: (Corns and all)

Though I absolutely refuse to short shoe and ensure there is adequate coverage, the marketplace forces me to shoe with less width and less length than I think is correct. :( But I insist on a shorter shoeing cycle for the sake of the horse.
Ant.
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 28 Mar 2010 22:09 #5

  • Gary_Miller
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Anywhere from an 1/8 to a 1/4 past the heel and tight.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
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"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 28 Mar 2010 22:43 #6

  • smitty88
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Gary_Miller wrote:
Anywhere from an 1/8 to a 1/4 past the heel and tight.

Why tight Gary
Smitty88
John Mc Loughlin
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 28 Mar 2010 23:07 #7

  • Gary_Miller
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smitty88 wrote:
Why tight Gary
Dry arid climate, hoofs are really hard, most horses are trail horses ridden in a rocky environment (they don't call it the rocky mountains for nothing) most of the time those that aren't usually will at one time or another so there is too much chance of catching a shoe under a rock or a tree root. Besides, the heels of the horses hoof don't flex/expand outwards upon loading they flex inwards, so there is really not much need for width/expansion with a strong healthy hoof.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

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"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 29 Mar 2010 00:36 #8

  • Joey Aczon
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Most recently my heel fit is aimed at matching the shape of the coronet band at the heel bulbs. Shoe pulling concerns will sometimes tighten up that goal.
Joey Aczon

Over-specialize and breed in weakness... It's slow death. :cool:

"I never make the mistake of arguing with people for whose opinions I have no respect." — Gibbon
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 29 Mar 2010 01:46 #9

  • Gary Hill
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Gary_Miller wrote:
Dry arid climate, hoofs are really hard, most horses are trail horses ridden in a rocky environment (they don't call it the rocky mountains for nothing) most of the time those that aren't usually will at one time or another so there is too much chance of catching a shoe under a rock or a tree root. Besides, the heels of the horses hoof don't flex/expand outwards upon loading they flex inwards, so there is really not much need for width/expansion with a strong healthy hoof.

Support of the whole limb is why one would want to have some shoe out to the sides. Grinding to a 45% helps with the stepping off problems. Also if you fit tight in 6 weeks you will surly have the heels of the shoes into the seat of corns so why shoe tight?:confused:
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 29 Mar 2010 03:58 #10

  • Gary_Miller
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Gary Hill wrote:
Support of the whole limb is why one would want to have some shoe out to the sides.
If thats what the horse needs.

Gary Hill wrote:
Grinding to a 45% helps with the stepping off problems.
Who said anything about stepping off problems.

Gary Hill wrote:
Also if you fit tight in 6 weeks you will surly have the heels of the shoes into the seat of corns so why shoe tight?:confused:
That would depend on the horses hoof growth, and how tight the fit is. As of yet I have not seen this problem with my fit and I'm on a 8 week cycle.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 29 Mar 2010 11:23 #11

  • chris bunting
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in everyday shoeing lenghth is to point of heel plus depth of stock , i.e.,3/4 x 3/8 = 3/8 long . 7/8 x 1/2 = 1/2 long .3/4 x 1/4 =1/4 long .
i understand what i am trying to say
chris
common sense is not needed when you have rules
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 29 Mar 2010 13:32 #12

  • Gary Hill
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My bad, apparently in Idado this time of the year horses feet don't grow and you don't shoe them so I guess it just doesn't matter?
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 29 Mar 2010 14:27 #13

  • THamilton
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Gary H.,

I understand where Gary Miller is coming from. It is a lessor of two evils if that is how you want to say it. The terrain at times dictates how we shoe. In the country where Gary M lives and shoes, if you leave heel length, there could be a whole bucket of worms to gather.

A horse tripping or stumbling as it grabs that 1/4" heel, even if it is ground at a 45 degree angle, then stumbling and having the owner get in a wreck on a rocky trail with no cell reception as they tumble down a 100 foot ravin.

I think I might shoe tight instead of having that happen.
"Nothing astonishes men so much as common sense and plain dealing" Ralph Waldo Emerson
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 29 Mar 2010 14:49 #14

  • Gary_Miller
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Gary Hill wrote:
My bad, apparently in Idado this time of the year horses feet don't grow and you don't shoe them so I guess it just doesn't matter?
Sure they grow, I do shoe them and it does matter. However, I have not had the problems you mentioned with how I fit so the fit must be OK. And like everything else it depends on the horse, the work its doing, the environment it lives in, ect..
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

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"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Heel Fit and Lenth 29 Mar 2010 15:03 #15

  • Gary_Miller
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THamilton wrote:
Gary H.,

I understand where Gary Miller is coming from. It is a lessor of two evils if that is how you want to say it. The terrain at times dictates how we shoe. In the country where Gary M lives and shoes, if you leave heel length, there could be a whole bucket of worms to gather.

A horse tripping or stumbling as it grabs that 1/4" heel, even if it is ground at a 45 degree angle, then stumbling and having the owner get in a wreck on a rocky trail with no cell reception as they tumble down a 100 foot ravin.

I think I might shoe tight instead of having that happen.
Or the shoe being pulled, because it was caught under a rock or a root on the trail, while the customer is 5 miles from the truck in steep rocky terrain.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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