Anyone ever done this? The owner is requesting the frog be exposed. I want to match the angles, but one foot is seveirly under-run. Im worried that if I cut the plastic degree or wedge pad to a rim pad and rivet the heels it may not be structurly sound enough when the horse is turning tightly. I will not be useing a degree shoe at the owners request. I will be useing kerkheat Triumps clipped. This is the front left foot. Horse will be doing uper level jumpers. What are your thoughts?

Feedback is greatly aprieciated.

Thank you!
Josh
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Hi Josh,

My initial thought is that if the owner knows so much, whay aren't THEY shoeing the horse???

having said that, applying a bar wedge between the shoe and the foot, properly riveted, leaves most of the frog exposed and should be stable enough to not move around.....you could use a dremmel tool to remove about 1/2 of the 'bar' part of the wedge pad along with anything that hangs to the inside of the shoe.....doesnt it seem like the owner is more worried about looks than function?...making it into a true rim wedge makes the chance of failure that much higher especially if they horse is worked a lot

if you cave to the owners request I would put EVERYTHING in writing noting instructions from the owner, etc.......when the S#!* hits the fan, guess who gets the blame?.....if this is just a great client, then I guess you do what you have to do...if they can be persuaded to have a little faith in what you do, then you might press the issue and try to do it your way

I like owner input until it interferes with the well being of the horse for the sake of looking good

just my opinion,

Derin

The problem with wedge rim pads is that the frog is now off of the ground and not bearing weight at all. If the horse needs wedges for low heel or crushed heels, guess what, take away frog pressure and the heels will really get crushed. I would only apply a wedge if I can also apply frog support. If that means rim wedge with hoofpak or dental impression material then that's what they get. I rim wedge with no frog support is only asking for trouble. If you can get enough frog support with a wedge bar pad, then maybe that's enough, but leaving the frog exposed in this situation is dangerous in my opinion. Not to mention that aluminum shoes aren't exactly stable, add to that a wedge rim pad, and you have a recipe for crushed heels. If that's what the owner wants, explain your concerns, if they still want it, take pictures and like Derin said write everything down. Don't let the owner know your taking notes but get it all down. I personally would think about not shoeing the horse at all if my concerns weren't enough to sway the owner. Or I would charge her soo much that she wouldn't call me back anyway.
Why does the owner want wedge pads to begin with?
Dave

Sorry, I just re-read your post and know why you're using wedges

Its funny this post is here now as i have been racking by brain as how to give frog support without covering up the sole i am not a fan of anything that cant breath.let us know what you do.

old heller wrote:
Well I did her tonight, and it turned out the under-run heel was not nealy as under-run as it looked at a glance... The toe was actually about a half inch longer on the that hoot than the other. So it can out really nice without a degree pad. But I couldnt talk her out of the Aluminiums on the hinds.. ahh well. Thanks for all the input guys! Even though I didnt use this time. =]

Thanks guys!
Josh
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Wow, I cannot believe the way some of you feel about your clients. Who is with the horse 24/7? And if the owner has an active roll in their horses career and health than they study about hoof structures and anatomy (any good owner will seek knowledge about these things). If you don't take into account what the owner is telling you, than you are playing a dangerous game. By no means am I saying to disregard your ideas, but don't disregard theirs either!! A GOOD farrier makes EVERYONE happy, the horse, the owner, and himself/herself.

The bar wedge pads are great, and they do allow contact with the frog if applied properly. The pad is flexable and stimulates the frog as it hits the ground. I have had great success with bar wedge pads, and will choose them over egg bar, bar, heart bar shoes, and/or solid bottom pads any day!!

Josh - I make rim wedges out of bar wedge pads and use them in cases where the frog will be in contact with the ground. Properly riveted they will not move. I have several performance horses in these and they remain stable. In cases where frog contact cannot be made I use the new perforated pad developed by EDSS and simply apply impression material in the rear portion of the foot and cut the remainder flush with the inner rim from the frog apex forward, thus exposing the remainder of the sole to air.

old heller wrote: While a bar wedge pad is nice and usually effective, I am rapidly becoming a fan of bar wedge pad with frog prosthesis. Castle makes these pads in two different heel thicknesses and the pad is 'softer' than its incarnation as McClain frog support bar wedge pad. Depending on what I find when I work on the bottom of the hoof, I use either one.

HorseHelper wrote: Interestingly enough, we farriers are incredulous about the level of TSS* exhibited by fluff bunnies who own horses.





* TSS: Terminal Stable ******ity

HorseHelper wrote:
The difference would be between the horse or the many horses or the dosens of horses of the client and the thousands of horses the farrier has worked on.
Again we all here get put right by someone who won't sign their name.
Bill

This was over a year ago. This was a horse that my father sold and needed shoeing. She wanted AL all the way around front and hind. As farriers we try to do whats right for the horse. Lots of the times the owners are missinformed or just htink they have the righ idea when they dont truely know the mechanics behind it. Thats why WE shoe the horses, not the owners. Allthough opinionated lots of farriers do keep an open mind.

HorseHelper wrote:
Who spend over 20 years or more working with horse's feet, not just the ones attached to your pet but of litterally thousands and thousands? Who spends his life, risking health, with a good chance he won't be able to do his job anymore when he's 60? All that just because he loves to work with horses and work on trouble those horses run into?
HorseHelper wrote:
A good shoer makes the horse happy even if that doesn't please the owner or the vet or God himself.
HorseHelper wrote:
Maybe you'd do even a better job when you'd be a little more flexible in choosing what's good for an invidual horse at any one time.


Ronald Aalders

Josh,

cutting and useing a degree or wedge pad as a rim should you ever need it in the future should not present any problems such as staying in place or being structuraly sound. The other issues brought up here need to be addressed but those are addressed everytime you shoe a horse with or without pads.


Regards

Ray Steele

I shod a DutchWB thursday for the first time and used a wedge. He had a broken axis and generalized heel pain 6 months ago that blocked out abaxially.

Fast forward to today, he's been shod with eggbars and full 2 degree wedges up front and bar wedges out back. He had thrush in the off fore and off hind. Rads looked ok, except for the broken axis, so I made a pair of concave straightbars- 3/8x7/8 for the wider web and reduced weight, set back to mechanically achieve a/p balance.

With the thrush, broken back, and pronounced frog; I applied a 1 deg. bar wedge with the bar cut out to take pressure away from the frog, and to help balance. I then poured in Equipak Copper Sulfate (green) to the foot surface level of the shoe.

On the hinds the bar wedge pads had created an anaerobic environment for thrush, and had crushed the rear half of the frog along with undermining the integrity of the heels. I applied a open shoe w/o pads and instructed the owner how to treat the thrush with Mastititus medication.

When wedging up anything I most likely apply bar wedges, cut out into a rim pad, then offer some kind of support for the sole and frog. Usually Equipak or the like. It works for me, and I don't often wedge horses, but when the situation dictates, I try to do what's right for the horse.

Pics to follow when I'm home and have a chance.

Here's the straight bar.

Here's the thrush.

The bar wedge cut out to eliminate direct pressure to the frog.