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TOPIC: beginning forge work

beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 02:34 #1

Well they are a far cry from good but here are my good ones from many.
rocker toe, square toe, trailer. Just a starting point
redd
Redd McIntyre
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 04:19 #2

  • clinkercjf
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What would be the practical application of the square/rocker toe?
Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils. Louis Hector Berlioz

Troy Ehrmantraut, CJF
2002 Journeyman Practical High Score Award.
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 04:26 #3

  • Rick Talbert
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Keep it up! Of the three mods I think your trailer is the best, but you have to be careful not to diminish the stock width. I think your rocker toe is a little eskew and is forged a little too far back. Square toe should be more defined. It takes guts to put your efforts out for everyone to critique. And these observations are all things that were told to me as well. Once you understand exactly what details the testers are looking for, the shoe board comes a little easier, but it is still the most difficult part of the certification process. IMO if you are working on a shoe board for the AFA I'd stick to one modification per shoe rather than putting 2 or 3 on one shoe. Good luck.
Rick Talbert
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 04:32 #4

Quicker break over is the application .. correct?
rocker toe can be forged alot better.. do you use the near or far side of your anvil
Redd McIntyre
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 05:49 #5

That’s right, you've got it, rocker on the front, square toe on the hind.
(mind you some put a square on the front, kinda like a nBS)

It has been pointed out here previously that;
The need for properly timed break over on the fronts is necessary.
But the hinds don't rightly break over; they unload and leave the ground.

I cannot remember who first post that here. But one of our esteemed.
(When I read that, I thought it was about right)

Important things to consider.

Kinda like a trailer, you wouldn’t put one on a front shoe.

PS.
If I rocker a shoe I do a full web rocker, as well, not much point otherwise. IMO
Bradley SaintJohn

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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 05:55 #6

Redd Mcintyre wrote:
Quicker break over is the application .. correct? rocker toe can be forged alot better..
do you use the near or far side of your anvil

Quicker break over, and still loading the entire hoof wall.
Near side, and one way to do it is: if you hold the tongs in your left hand,
the tong jaws should grab the right branchon the inside,
the rains of the tongs go, one on top, and one below the left heel.

The rains straddle the left heel,
this way you are holding both heels and keeping them level to each other.



To make the rocker, Hit once left, and once right, leave the middle alone.



Then turn it over, tilt the shoe up so the rocker is on the anvil,
and flaten the rocker at the foot surface.



Bradley SaintJohn

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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 06:04 #7

  • Rick Talbert
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I use the near side of the anvil. All your modifications should be practical to nail on a hoof. The question was meant to make you think about this and sounds like exactly what a tester would ask if you handed him a shoe with both these mods on it. The answer is that there is no practical application for a square toe/ rocker toe. Another example of why you should do just one mod per shoe. Most guys put the rocker toe, toe clip, and rolled toe mods on front shoes. Square toe, trailer, extended heels, side clips on hind shoes. You can drill and tap and put in screw in studs for 1 easy traction device. If you hand forge your straight bar shoe then you can fuller it across the toe and this is your second traction device. Your punched nail hole is also fulfilled with a handmade bar shoe. Make your bar shoe a little bigger than your other front shoes and you can apply a wedge pad and bevel the pad to the size of your other shoes. Each mod should be crisp and well defined. Each should be forged to the standards put forth in the AFA book. All fronts and all hinds should be shaped the same, level, and have a nice finish.
Rick Talbert
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 06:30 #8

handmade pride wrote:
I think the square toe helps the back dig in better too. Looks to me like a rocker would do some slipping on the hind end.

Check back up there I added photos.
Bradley SaintJohn

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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 12:05 #9

Thanks Bradley for the tips.

Thanks Rick for your advice about the mods when I did them I was thinking about what i could do to the shoe not much more. I do appreciate steering me in the right direction about shoe board mods

Keep the tips coming in

Thanks Redd
Redd McIntyre
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 13:44 #10

  • clinkercjf
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In order to fit a square/rocker toe, you would have to leave so much extra foot for fitting that it would negate any mechanical benefits.
Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils. Louis Hector Berlioz

Troy Ehrmantraut, CJF
2002 Journeyman Practical High Score Award.
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 13:46 #11

  • clinkercjf
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Redd, are you working on the AFA certified shoe display?
Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils. Louis Hector Berlioz

Troy Ehrmantraut, CJF
2002 Journeyman Practical High Score Award.
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 15:47 #12

  • Jack Evers
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One more hint Redd. When you pull the trailer on a keg shoe, the metal you take moves the center point and since the branches are already formed around a different point, the whole shoe gets somewhat askew. Last I talked to a tester he felt you should start with a size larger, then cut some stock off the other heel to get better balance.
Jack Evers CJF AFA#426

The best things about the good old days -- I wasn't good and I wasn't old.

The older I get, the more horses I shoe, the fewer things that I can absolutely, positively fix.
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 18:34 #13

clinkercjf wrote:
In order to fit a square/rocker toe, you would have to leave so much extra foot for fitting that it would negate any mechanical benefits.


A rocker toe takes length from the foot when fitted, where the square toe does not.


Ronald Aalders
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 18:51 #14

  • Rick Talbert
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when i did my trailer mod, I did just what jack said, and started with a size larger shoe, forged a trailer, and then cut some length off the medial heel and forged my heel check, and I think this is what most everyone does. But using a size larger shoe didn't look quite right to me as I compared that particular shoe to the rest of my hind shoes, being a larger size it made the heel nails a little further back than what my eye liked. I solved this by taking a st croix heeled shoe and forging down the heel calks giving me essentially a long heeled keg shoe. This will give you plenty of steel to work with for the trailer modification, you still cut off the excessive length on the medial branch. The advantage of doing this is that the shoe is of the appropriate size for the hoof, the forging of the trailer is easy, and it matches up nicely with your other hind shoes (all the nail holes match up) this makes the shoe board look much ***ier.
Rick Talbert
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RE:beginning forge work 08 Nov 2008 19:00 #15

I use a rocker toe sometimes, and when fitting have tried two different ways. The first was by simply burning off the tow, the secong was by raspong an angle to match the rocker, then hot fitting. Seemed much easier witht he second method. How do you all do it?
Its as good as I can do it, every time I get to do it

Matt McMicken
Farriery and such
FL (239)243-4325
WV (304)647-0100
USA
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