make up natural cara make up make up tutorial make up korea make up minimalis make up artis make up mata belajar make up make up wardah alat make up makeup forever indonesia makeup artist jakarta tips make up barbie make up natural make up make up wajah make up pesta make up syahrini makeup mata makeup minimalis peralatan make up make up cantik make up mac make up kit jual make up make up sederhana perlengkapan make up gambar make up vidio make up cara makeup minimalis wardah make up make up pac make up glamour cara memakai makeup make up panggung harga make up make up modern make up alami make up dasar pixy make up make up muslimah make up oriflame make up jepang makeover cosmetic make up ultima make up sariayu grosir make up makeup fantasi makeup pesta tas makeup langkah make up make up pria make up malam alat makeup tahapan make up produk make up shading make up mak up make up kebaya make up jilbab make up inez make up simpel contoh make up cara ber makeup makeup wajah tanpa make up make up terbaru toko make up mac makeup indonesia make up soft urutan make up trik make up makeover makeup brand gusnaldi make up paket make up panduan make up jual makeup brush make up bagus alat2 make up make up gusnaldi aplikasi make up alat alat makeup dasar make up inez make up peralatan makeup make up wanita make up berjilbab make up tebal sejarah make up make up maybeline make up branded make up siang tata cara makeup reseller make up make up muslim make up maybelin warna make up tips make up artist rias make up make up mata make up artis belajar make up make up artist kursus make up kuas make up make up forever indonesia jual make up mac indonesia make up make up artist indonesia harga make up forever jual make up online make up pac make up forever jakarta make up oriflame jual make up forever make up online shop indonesia harga make up sekolah make up grosir make up harga make up maybelline jual make up murah make up terbaru mak up mac make up indonesia sofia make up make up kit murah mac makeup indonesia produk make up jual make up kit make up store indonesia make up forever academy jakarta toko make up online jual make up set jual make up mac make up beauty jual make up branded produk make up mac make up forever harga make up mac indonesia produk make up artis jual make up palette produk make up forever make up palette murah before after make up pengantin before after make up sendiri before n after hasil makeup contoh make up karakter contoh riasan pengantin before n after harga make up wisuda harga make up artist harga make up forever make up wisuda rias wisuda di jogja Daftar harga make up forever daftar harga make up mac daftar harga kosmetik make up forever makeup wisuda harga makeup wisuda kursus make up di yogyakarta kursus make up di jogja kursus make up jogja kursus make up yogyakarta kursus kecantikan di yogyakarta kursus kecantikan di jogja kursus make up artist di jogja kursus rias pengantin di jogja kursus rias di yogyakarta kursus tata rias di yogyakarta rias pengantin muslim jogja jasa kreasi jilbab wisuda yogyakarta jasa rias make up wisuda murah bagus bisa dpanggil tempat make uf di jigja yang bagus rias wisuda murah dan berkualitas yogyakarta pakar kreasi jilbab di jogja make uper natural yogya make up wisuda hijab area jogja make up dan kreasi jilbab yang bagus di jogja jasa make up natural untuk wisuda jogja makeup jogja make up jogja makeup yogyakarta make up yogyakarta makeup wisuda jogja make up wisuda jogja make up wisuda yogyakarta makeup wisuda yogyakarta
Thursday December 1, 2022
Welcome, Guest
Username: Password: Remember me

TOPIC: farrier workshop on improving your horsemanship skills when shoeing a horse

RE:farrier workshop on improving your horsemanship skills when shoeing a horse 13 Aug 2011 18:16 #31

  • Rick Burten
  • Rick Burten's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Enforcer
  • Posts: 9082
  • Thank you received: 50
  • Karma: 8
Gary Hill wrote:
Rick, I never said train..I said handle,
Gary, I understand. So perhaps my question should have been, "if in the course of handling a horse, especially if you are doing something to alter its behavior if only for a brief time, the horse reacts and is injured or injures or damages someone else or something else, is your manner of handling going to be called into question and as a result, expose you to legal risk or defamation?

This, along with Bruce's list of things farrier's may, in the course of their workday, do, is the reason Care, Custody and Control Insurance exists. I note, for the record, that some of the things Bruce listed will probably result in a judgement against you or at a minimum, a knock on your reputation. I also note for the record that I am guilty of at least a few of the acts Bruce lists, much less so now than when I was younger and suffered from Testosterone Poisoning. :o

It is my considered opinion and experience that every time we interact with a horse one or more of the following occurs"
1. You train the horse
2. The horse trains you
3. You train each other.

I feel it is important to always bear that in mind as 'handling the horse' is always a form of one or more of those interactions and will have repercussions even if/when you are not negligent.

When someone retains my services as a farrier, I do my level best to stick to being a farrier in the strictest sense of the term. Bear in mind that the instant you put the halter on a horse or snap a lead on a horse or touch the horse to begin evaluating or working, that horse has come under your care, custody and control and you are legally responsible for everything that then ensues.

And, I think that any farrier who carries chemical restraint and/or the means to administer it, and then does administer it whether the farrier or client provides said chemical restraint and means of administration, is really foolish and had better have very, very deep pockets. Even insurance won't cover you if you are charged with and/or convicted of practicing veterinary medicine without a license.

Also, Bruce is correct regarding being sued for negligence. Its a tough charge to prove, but defending yourself against the charge can be a very expensive ordeal.
You can prick a hoof with a nail and be sued...so under the opinions of others are you just going to glue on shoe's from now on ?
Of course not. The plaintiff still has to prove negligence.
If you can always work on horses that are super to work on then you are either very lucky or have very few clients.
ALSO since animals are totally unpredictable, when this perfect animal you work on becomes upset or scared or urully for a number of possible reasons, according to what I have read, you all will just pack your tools and walk away...
Not necessarily. As with most everything equid related, It Depends. :)

And for the record, Bruce, I am not taking issue with either you or your methods. If that is the impression I gave, then I apologize. I think your methods are good and reasonable and if we, as farriers, routinely dealt with horsemen/women, my concerns would be much more mitigated. But the sad fact is that nowadays we deal with horse owners who on the best day of their lives wouldn't make a pimple on a horseman's butt. YMMV
Rick Burten PF

In the immortal words of Ron White: "But let me tell you something, folks: You can't fix S-tupid. There's not a pill you can take; there's not a class you can go to. S-tupid is forever."
."


Je pense donc je suis
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:farrier workshop on improving your horsemanship skills when shoeing a horse 13 Aug 2011 19:31 #32

  • Gary Hill
  • Gary Hill's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Guru
  • Posts: 5298
  • Thank you received: 6
  • Karma: 4
Bottom line Rick is, the fact so many horseowners are just that. They bought a horse for the family and on relie on what the remember when they were kids, whip and ride ...It is my donkey under the horse so I do take control of the animal so it stays off of me..most the time I run off the owners and the horse is fine??:D
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:farrier workshop on improving your horsemanship skills when shoeing a horse 13 Aug 2011 20:08 #33

  • vthorseshoe
  • vthorseshoe's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Master
  • Posts: 2841
  • Thank you received: 55
  • Karma: 11
Rick,
I never take offense at anything you try to point out to others. Quite the contrary I appreciate someone playing devil's advocate and letting others see both sides of a coin rather than just one side.
Just as much as I appreciate someones genuine belief and concern for the well being of others.

And while I am on the subject, let it be known to all who are reading, I hold you and your advice and skills in the highest of regards.
As a clinician you are still remembered by the folks who attended your clinic in Vermont. They not only remark on the lessons we learned but they constantly remark on the relaxed manner and the genuine interest you showed for each and every participant.

The years we have been on this site alone I have learned more from you than I bet you even realize.

I have been around horseshoers all my life and you've always been the real deal and one of my most valued friends.

my 2 cents worth ;)
"you may not like what I say" !
-but-
"you'll never have any doubts where I stand
quote Cindy Matthews 1948-2006


I thought my life had come to a close with Cindy's passing, but there is life after death Thankyou Sharon !

Bruce Matthews
Southeast...
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:farrier workshop on improving your horsemanship skills when shoeing a horse 17 Aug 2011 22:30 #34

  • ray tyron
  • ray tyron's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Very Senior Member
  • Posts: 781
  • Karma: 0
You guys are absolutely right in a way. Being a mean, lean, horse fighting machine is not good for business and not part of our job and will probably line you up for a trip to the E. R. or a book full of those types of horses and a lifetime of shoeing dinks. However most good clients owen good horses and I find that they rally care about how there horses are handled. When just one of those type customers hear a friend say "old so and so did my horse and was so patient and took the time to work threw the problem. "i think you'll find your books filling up with people who take the time and work with there horses. Evan if you have no intention of training ,learning this stuff will make your day a little less stressful and a hole lot safer for you and your horses. Knowing. This stuff will put you in a position to see a bad situation befor something bad happens and give you a few alternatives to avoid putting your self or the horse into that situation. But maybe your all rite ,its not our job we don't need to know.
Nothing forced or misunderstood can ever be beautiful.
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:farrier workshop on improving your horsemanship skills when shoeing a horse 24 Aug 2011 14:35 #35

  • vthorseshoe
  • vthorseshoe's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Master
  • Posts: 2841
  • Thank you received: 55
  • Karma: 11
Last night at 6 p.m. until 7:30 p.m. I worked on two large Clydesdales last night with seperate problems of their own...

The first had a history of abcessing after (according to the owner) being quicked. The left rear grew a rather large hoof and she eventually had the local vet x-ray it.
I took a trip to the vet and the only thing I noticed was some calcification in the articulating area's.

When I picked up her hind leg she pulled away each time.
I then went ahead and trimmed all the other 3 legs and made her comfortable, then went back to tackle the left hind.
I lowered my foot stool to the max and tried that. She was uncomfortable with the leg being raised and bent.
I then tried lifting her leg with out bending the joint and brought the stool in from the front instead of setting the leg on it from the top.
This worked for a short time, enough to take one swipe with the knife, so I then got her to relax her leg and I drew it forward on the foot stool and proceeded to trim the outer wall with it setting on the stool (in the manner where you would use it to rasp the walls).
This allowed me to take the wall down and then focus on cleaning the sole.

I then asked for the leg and instead of picking it up from the ground, I slid it back leaving the toe on the ground and in this manner I was able to clean out the sole area of the excess material that had built up.
I then brought it forward once again on the foot stool and rasped and cleaned up all the rough areas.

The whole thing with this mare was the bending of the pastern joint causeing her discomfort, SO ! I just worked around it and got the job done.


The second mare was a young mare who had been handled by a young person and she developed the habit of kicking with her right hind.

I went through the process and schoing with my long cotton rope and in less than 5 minutes I was trimming this mare in the normal fashion with her hind leg supported by my thighs and knee's.
I then proceeded to trim the other three and finished the second mare and was packing my tools to go home.

Now this account is a large one and well worth my time working on these two mares. 17 head of Clydesdales at this one stop...
I worked on, schooled on and trimmed all around these two large Clydesdales in 1 1/2 hrs and was loading my tools and equipment and heading for home with a check in my hand..

The owner was smiling and said she fully expected this mare to give me a "LOT" of problems.

I post this to give others an insight into what I will show at any clinic I am invited to put on.
An insight into looking at a problem and figureing out a manner to work through it without getting hurt or fighting with the animal. Thus accomplishing your task at hand and over time you will find the horse improves and gets easier to work on until it stands like a well mannered normal horse.

my 2 cents worth ;)
"you may not like what I say" !
-but-
"you'll never have any doubts where I stand
quote Cindy Matthews 1948-2006


I thought my life had come to a close with Cindy's passing, but there is life after death Thankyou Sharon !

Bruce Matthews
Southeast...
The administrator has disabled public write access.

Kunena Birthday Module

  • DogwoodFarm birthday is today
  • DressageReine birthday is today
  • ElCamino birthday is today
  • FarrierNTexas birthday is today
  • mark_jakopak birthday is today
  • Matt McMicken birthday is today
  • Matt_McMicken birthday is today
  • docsvoodoochic birthday is in 1 day
  • Ishoem4u birthday is in 1 day
  • JessyJay birthday is in 1 day
  • min54teresa birthday is in 1 day
  • TWH-BILL birthday is in 1 day
  • flossie55 birthday is in 364 days
Time to create page: 0.208 seconds

S5 Box

Register

*
*
*
*
*
*

Fields marked with an asterisk (*) are required.