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TOPIC: Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think???

RE:Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think??? 28 Sep 2009 12:16 #31

  • cuttinshoer
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RockinJFarrier wrote:
Just because you have that sign in your barn doesn't help you. Those signs are pretty much useless, If you don't have the insurance to back it.

Justin Ebner

I have a good lawyer and insurance.

Justin
Justin Decker

"As I see it, good enough is never good enough, it's just an excuse for mediocrity. If every shoeing ain't worth your best shot, you're just going through the motions." Tom Stovall, CJF
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RE:Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think??? 28 Sep 2009 13:20 #32

  • Gary_Miller
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Travis Reed wrote:
In this case the farrier not taking the necessary measurements to protect injury from his nails after driving them he would be held liable

The only issue with that is … who said leaving the nail out and not wrung off is the industry standard. For sure common sense would tell ya not to leave the nail out,, but the law don’t take common sense into effect I don’t think… so we are still back to square one…. If horse had not pulled away the farrier would not have lost his balance…
I think in this case it would come down to what standard practice in the industry is. Which in my training would be to wrung off the nail or bend the nail over against the hoof wall as quickly as passable after driving the nail. However, there is that period of time where the horse may pull away while the nail is still protruding out the hoof wall. Which is something I find to be out of the farriers control.
Gary Miller, PF

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RE:Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think??? 28 Sep 2009 20:52 #33

  • Travis Reed
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gary
Which is something I find to be out of the farriers control.
..

right you are Gary... the only reason i am intrested in this thread is i have friend that works for a judge.... and some of the cases are just a waste of tax payers money... and IMO most of the cases sound like a scam to just get a insurance co to settle out of court for the simple reason of win lose or draw its cheaper to pay up then battle it out and people know it...

Gary to go a step higher any time someone is dealing with something that is not able to reason but have a mind of its own is out of our control... i bet Mr Hill in texas can give many examples of that working with diff kinds of animals in a circus ...
Travis Reed.....


www.sporthorsefarrier.com to direct link..
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RE:Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think??? 29 Sep 2009 13:12 #34

  • DavidinGA
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Here's my take on this case as a (undergrad) law student and a horse owner/shoer.

The issue in this case is not the injury, the farrier did his duty by reporting the injury and the vet was called and treated the injury. At this point the farrier's responsibilities ended. The issue ( and what cost so much) was the infection and treatment of the infection. Infections ( in my experience) are always caused by care. Therefor, the reason the horse's wound got infected was lack of proper care. Surely, no one in their right mind would expect the farrier to come over and treat the wound everyday until it healed.

As far as the injury to the horse goes, who cares if he bent the nails or rung them off? How many times has everyone of us got stuck/scraped by a bent or wrung off nail? In fact if you picture what was described you'll see that it was probably safer for the horse to leave the nails straight and pushed in against the hoof. The more likely cause of the injury is the metal shoe brushing against the hock and that would have broken the skin even if glued on. Therefor, the blame again falls to the owner for requesting that the farrier install metal shoes on the horse.

I would think that any ambulance chaser could easily defend the farrier in this case. In GA or KY it wouldn't even make it to court because of the equine law ( similar to the Delaware law that has been posted) and yes in these two states the horse is considered a participant in the equine activity.

The only part I can see the farrier possibly being held responsible for is the initial vet care. However, I still think that if you are going into business of any kind you should carry liability insurance.

David
David H. Van Hook
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RE:Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think??? 29 Sep 2009 13:40 #35

  • Gary_Miller
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Travis Reed wrote:
right you are Gary... the only reason i am intrested in this thread is i have friend that works for a judge.... and some of the cases are just a waste of tax payers money... and IMO most of the cases sound like a scam to just get a insurance co to settle out of court for the simple reason of win lose or draw its cheaper to pay up then battle it out and people know it...
Until Judges get the guts to start throwing out ridiculous law suits and charging a fee to those lawyers who keep bringing them to court, these type of cases will just continue to clog up the court system costing millions in tax payers dollars.

But I don't see that happening being that Judges now days are coming out of the lawyer career field.
Gary Miller, PF

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RE:Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think??? 29 Sep 2009 14:29 #36

  • DavidinGA
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Gary_Miller wrote:
Until Judges get the guts to start throwing out ridiculous law suits and charging a fee to those lawyers who keep bringing them to court, these type of cases will just continue to clog up the court system costing millions in tax payers dollars.

But I don't see that happening being that Judges now days are coming out of the lawyer career field.

Gary as far as I know that's the only place that judges come from. Also, as to your point about the judges throwing out BS cases, lawyers in GA can be debarred for filing frivolous cases. Now if we could just get some one to define frivolous and start enforcing that law we'd be a lot better off.

David
David H. Van Hook
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RE:Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think??? 29 Sep 2009 15:12 #37

  • Gary_Miller
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DavidinGA wrote:
Gary as far as I know that's the only place that judges come from.
While it is the norm now days to have a law degree and most judges have first been lawyers. It is not a requirement to become a judge.

Here is a link to the job discription.http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos272.htm
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think??? 29 Sep 2009 16:23 #38

  • DavidinGA
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Gary_Miller wrote:
While it is the norm now days to have a law degree and most judges have first been lawyers. It is not a requirement to become a judge.

Here is a link to the job discription.http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos272.htm

Cool,

Learn something everyday.

Thanks
David
David H. Van Hook
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RE:Would you and do you carry insurance. What do you think??? 08 Oct 2009 11:01 #39

  • cynthia-jay
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On the other side of the moon....

the owner is also at fault/ liability

crossties are known to be dangerous

I quit using those things (years ago)when horses started going over backwards for any known reason ending up on the cement floors (didn't happen to me) injuring horse /handler

How safe was the enviroment that was provided fo the Farrier?

quicking a horse was the cause of action

not clinching nails is an act of neglect

both parties are at fault in regards to this incident

whenever there is a lawsuit/a counter suit can be filed

also, an appeal to the Judges decision can be filed

this can be a long dragged out process

in the end, both parties may walk out empied handed with alot of expenses

as to why the Farrier was not insured/ why was the owner not either for injury/death on the animal?

even upon judgement/ collection can be next to nothing

It alls depends on the Judges decision based on evidence presented/ and of coarse if the Judge is having a bad day:D

I am not practicing law here either/ just an opinion based on experiance

and yes, carry liability insurance

interesting case

good luck

c jay
Cynthia Jay
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shoot first, ask questions later, dead men tell no tails, nor do they tie up the legal system or jails
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