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TOPIC: Starting Business in Europe(Portugal)

RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 24 Feb 2010 19:21 #31

  • Ray_Knightley
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chris bunting wrote:
mark,just been done by the fiscal police again this morning,documentation recorded i had 60 shoes and associated products,i had 58 shoes and no documents to account for missing pair.vehicle impounded and 35 euro fine. hope to get van back friday,more likely next week.
chris

NOT AGAIN!!!!:eek::mad:
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 24 Feb 2010 21:13 #32

  • Gabino
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Mike Ferrara wrote:
You might want to read this. http://www.justlanded.com/english/Portugal/Portugal-Guide/Business/Starting-a-Business-in-Portugal

It sounds very difficult (and probably not very profitable) for some one who isn't an EU national to get set up in Portugal.

This link is very rigth.The burocracy in Portugal is more hard than Spain. In Portugal the most of the farriers are in "black market".No bill,no tax,no health assurance,etc

Besides,when the police get an stranger farrier that he speeks english,they think "Well,we get the country bumpkin for today"
Gabino Fernández Baquero

www.farriergabino.com
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 25 Feb 2010 07:23 #33

  • kanehill
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Well, it sounds like I chose an interesting place to start a shoeing business,

Thanks to y'all for the advise and input. All I can hope for is enough clients to make the "struggle" against the bureaucracy worth it!

Gambino like the look of your truck but a little hesitant to commit to a purchase like that after hearing all these horror stories.

Loved Oz where when you start out put your tools in the back of a pickup and once you have built up a good client base upgrade to a great little workshop on wheels....oh well put it down to another of lifes experiences.
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 26 Feb 2010 13:32 #34

  • kanehill
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Ok Guys,

Once again thanks for all the replies. I have decided just to bite the bullet and go for it! After all I love horses and I love shoeing....starting a business in Portugal sure sounds difficult but when you put it in perspective, I could be in Afganistan or Iraq.....now those boys are doing it tough!

So I think I may have mentioned before, my blacksmithing skills are not the greatest so if any of you know of a blacksmith in the Lisbon/Portugal or Spanish region who wants to take on a willing pupil for a week at a time every now and then I would appreciate you passing my name on. I am not a rocket scientist but I have a little common sense and I am a hard worker!

Thanks in advance!
Hope I can give you all some good news in the future!
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 26 Feb 2010 15:01 #35

  • vthorseshoe
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Boy ! just read this whole thread and my hat is off to you.

Mike made a comment about, "this is where we could be going if not careful in this country".

This is why things need to be done correctly so others won't impose such restictions on farriers here in the USA.

Hap Hazard/slip shod farriers (and I use the term farrier loosely),
who buy tools and trim/shoe from the get go open up the pathway to such restrictions as in Portugal.

Being in a position to help guide or set standards for our industry is much more productive than letting some disgruntaled owner or Peta (or other do gooder) with some clout in government intiate laws that will end up like what these folks in Portugal are telling us.

my 2 cents worth ;)
"you may not like what I say" !
-but-
"you'll never have any doubts where I stand
quote Cindy Matthews 1948-2006


I thought my life had come to a close with Cindy's passing, but there is life after death Thankyou Sharon !

Bruce Matthews
Southeast...
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 04 Mar 2010 11:20 #36

  • chris bunting
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time is 11.00 am march 4 2010 ,just got my van back from the GNR police. has been impounded for 8 days for carrying 10 horseshoes not recorded on my transport documentation. i am still not allowed to drive it as the vehicle documents cannot be released due to a strike in the fiscal office . the payment department took the fine money 31.25 euros. if i drive it is a minimum fine of 10 000 euros and automatic seisure of the vehicle . it is classed as a civil disobedience worse than murder 1. i am feeling down at the minute , i have lost working 23 days in 3 1/2 months been fined less than 90 euros in total inc tax .if i had worked the government would have pocketed about 1400 euros in taxes this place is rapidly becoming a banana republic
chris
common sense is not needed when you have rules
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 04 Mar 2010 11:59 #37

  • Mike Ferrara
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vthorseshoe wrote:
Boy ! just read this whole thread and my hat is off to you.

Mike made a comment about, "this is where we could be going if not careful in this country".

This is why things need to be done correctly so others won't impose such restictions on farriers here in the USA.

Hap Hazard/slip shod farriers (and I use the term farrier loosely),
who buy tools and trim/shoe from the get go open up the pathway to such restrictions as in Portugal.

Being in a position to help guide or set standards for our industry is much more productive than letting some disgruntaled owner or Peta (or other do gooder) with some clout in government intiate laws that will end up like what these folks in Portugal are telling us.

my 2 cents worth ;)

There's always somebody trying to tell someone else what to do. If you want standards, I'll send you a write up detailing how I want things done from now on.

Bruce, if you do some reading, you'll see that the regulation in Potugal has nothing to do with insuring the quality of horseshoeing. It's about money and power. They want to make certain that no money changes hands unless they get their cut first.

Owners aren't pushing for regulation in the US. Farriers are. It's about control of the trade and protection from competition. If it were up to PETA, the horse would be in your living room watching TV and you would be out on the road pulling the cart. The government will go along with anything that gives Pelosi more money to spend on booze and travel for family members.
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 04 Mar 2010 12:04 #38

  • Mike Ferrara
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chris bunting wrote:
time is 11.00 am march 4 2010 ,just got my van back from the GNR police. has been impounded for 8 days for carrying 10 horseshoes not recorded on my transport documentation. i am still not allowed to drive it as the vehicle documents cannot be released due to a strike in the fiscal office . the payment department took the fine money 31.25 euros. if i drive it is a minimum fine of 10 000 euros and automatic seisure of the vehicle . it is classed as a civil disobedience worse than murder 1. i am feeling down at the minute , i have lost working 23 days in 3 1/2 months been fined less than 90 euros in total inc tax .if i had worked the government would have pocketed about 1400 euros in taxes this place is rapidly becoming a banana republic
chris

Sorry to hear it. That's some scary stuff. 23 days off work is enough lost income to put some folks in a real bind . I wish you luck.
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 04 Mar 2010 12:11 #39

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i used to shoe in the uk ,they have compulsory registration and regulation,i agree that farriers should be qualified to minimum standards that ideally would be self regulated but having a governmental body registering and regulating is not on .you are lucky in the usa that you dont have this. you are unlucky because farrier standards are difficult to maintain.
chris
common sense is not needed when you have rules
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 04 Mar 2010 12:14 #40

  • chris bunting
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thanks mike , onwards and upwards as they say. just glad farriers are not regulated here i would probably gone to jail.
chris
common sense is not needed when you have rules
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 04 Mar 2010 19:17 #41

  • George Geist
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vthorseshoe wrote:
.

This is why things need to be done correctly so others won't impose such restictions on farriers here in the USA.

Hap Hazard/slip shod farriers (and I use the term farrier loosely),
who buy tools and trim/shoe from the get go open up the pathway to such restrictions as in Portugal.

Being in a position to help guide or set standards for our industry is much more productive than letting some disgruntaled owner or Peta (or other do gooder) with some clout in government intiate laws that will end up like what these folks in Portugal are telling us.

my 2 cents worth ;)
Absolutely right as usual Bruce. Excellent point.

Mike Ferrara wrote:

Bruce, if you do some reading, you'll see that the regulation in Potugal has nothing to do with insuring the quality of horseshoeing. It's about money and power.
And this can be read where?
Owners aren't pushing for regulation in the US.
Unfortunately no
Farriers are.
And you see this where?
It's about control of the trade and protection from competition.
How do you equate setting a standard with being anti-competition?
George
For another fun place to play........
www.horseshoersforum.invisionzone.com
Come over and say hello.
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 04 Mar 2010 20:22 #42

  • Mike Ferrara
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George Geist wrote:

And this can be read where?


I believe I provided one or more links already.

Unfortunately no

Who says it's unfortunate?

And you see this where?


On this site for starters. More notably, a few years ago within the AFA.
How do you equate setting a standard with being anti-competition?

What have you said concerning price?
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 04 Mar 2010 21:31 #43

  • George Geist
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Mike Ferrara wrote:
I believe I provided one or more links already.
Not that I recall, You're now an authority on the where's and whys of how things are done in Portugal? I think is safe to say most of us never cared enough about the place to have any interest.
Who says it's unfortunate?
Me and probably those who agree with me.
On this site for starters. More notably, a few years ago within the AFA.
This site? ROTFLMFAO!!!!! What has this site ever done to promote such a thing? AFA never made any moves in that direction either and you know it.
What have you said concerning price?
I've said a lot of things about price. Name a specific example.
George
For another fun place to play........
www.horseshoersforum.invisionzone.com
Come over and say hello.
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 04 Mar 2010 23:17 #44

  • Mike Ferrara
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George Geist wrote:
Not that I recall, You're now an authority on the where's and whys of how things are done in Portugal?

Your recoloction isn't very good. Check post 23 of this thread for a start.

I think is safe to say most of us never cared enough about the place to have any interest.

You're probably right. I did a little research on Portugal after reading Chris's post. I can't say that I care much aside from having some sympathy for Chris and hoping like hell that you libs don't make it like that here.
Me and probably those who agree with me.

This site? ROTFLMFAO!!!!! What has this site ever done to promote such a thing? AFA never made any moves in that direction either and you know it.


The afa as an organization? Maybe not but there was Craig's infamous letter from the pres and a bunch of noise before they denied it all.

As far as this site, all any one need do is read some of the regulation threads.
I've said a lot of things about price. Name a specific example.
George

If I get time I'll look through some of your old posts.
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RE:Starting Business in Europe(Portugal) 05 Mar 2010 16:46 #45

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Hey Guys,

I dont want to rain on your parade, tell me if I am out of line, but this here discussion is about starting a business in Portugal.....leave the politics to politicians.... or a different thread! The way I see it we are all working class men its about blood, mud, sweat and tears, we want to see that horse walk away happy!

Let the fat boys, and pretty boys in suits and ties ***** and moan, we are above that!

Anyway y'all have a good day and pray for the boys who are doing it hard!
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