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TOPIC: Gypsy- Foundered pony

Gypsy- Foundered pony 13 Feb 2011 22:01 #1

  • Lori McBride
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Hello all,
I met Gypsy 6 weeks ago. She foundered on rancid grain a little over a year ago. According to the vet who treated her at the time she rotated 25*in her RF and 22* in the LF. Since then she has had virtually no real hoof care. The previous “farrier” had just been sawing off the front of her hooves. The bottom of her feet hadn't been touched for a very long time. I have no rads, so I am working blind.
When I first saw her she was very unwilling to walk down the concrete walkway, in the sand she was more comfortable. She would not let me pick up her front feet on the hard surface. Her heels were very far forward, almost to where COA should have been. I trimmed her heels back as much as I thought I could and put her in NB Center Fit with NB frog support pads packed with IM. After the shoes went on she seemed pretty comfortable, was willing to walk at pretty good pace down the concrete and I could pick up a font foot for a few minutes at a time. Over the next couple of weeks barn manager said she was improving. Willing to turn on her LF.
Four weeks later, I came back to re set the shoes. I added a wedge to her RF and used Sil Pack instead of IM. She is totally willing to stand on one front foot at a time, in fact I caught her several times resting the opposite hind while I was working on the front. She was walking head down to get the little scraps of hay, and seemed to genuinely be happy. Another indicator that she is feeling better is she is starting to have much more “pony” attitude. :rolleyes::D I do have MUCH to learn in this area. So any thoughts on things I should be looking out for or doing differently, (or if you see something just plain wrong :o ) would be greatly appreciated. :) Thanks in advance.
Lori McBride CF
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RE:Gypsy- Foundered pony 13 Feb 2011 22:05 #2

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Sorry the "before" solar shot of is so poor. :o
Lori McBride CF
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RE:Gypsy- Foundered pony 13 Feb 2011 22:14 #3

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These are of her first re set, four weeks from the first time I worked on her.
Lori McBride CF
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RE:Gypsy- Foundered pony 13 Feb 2011 22:37 #4

  • Gabino
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A subcoronal groove could help him much. I would cut the heels further,and put a plastic wedge. It's no easy to shoe a founder without rads.
Gabino Fernández Baquero

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RE:Gypsy- Foundered pony 14 Feb 2011 10:08 #5

I think the foundered way longer than 6 weeks ago ;)

As Gabino said, without rads shoeing laminitic horses is like walking in the dark, you may want to try and persuade the owner to get them made.

On a rotation like you mentioned, dropping the heels sounds like a good idea, you may want to check out Dr. O'Grady's article on realigning P3 in laminitic horses. It's on this website.

The after pics suggest you could have lowered the heels even more, especially considering the amount of rotation the vet told you the pony has. By the way it's save to call a +15 degree rotation a high end laminitis case. If your worked help a high end laminitis case pull through you did a good job!

Do keep in mind that realigning P3 is vital. Work towards a straight HPA, raise heels to reduce DDFT pull and bring back break over as much as your capacities allow you. Don't forget to add hoofpack at the posterior part of the foot.

I myself was never too succesful with any grooving method, in general I feel you have to have realy good reasons to reduce the overall strength of the hoofcapsule. I read on people being succesful with it though. In this particular case I would like to suggest you wait.


Ronald Aalders
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RE:Gypsy- Foundered pony 14 Feb 2011 14:37 #6

  • Lori McBride
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Thank you Gabino and Ron! I appreciate your time and knowledge.

I think the foundered way longer than 6 weeks ago

Yeah, she foundered a little over a year ago...... I just saw her for the first time 6 weeks ago. :)
As Gabino said, without rads shoeing laminitic horses is like walking in the dark, you may want to try and persuade the owner to get them made.

I am trying to convince them to get current rads, they had lats done when she first foundered (over a year ago), and they are under the impression that those should be sufficient. At the time I just couldn't walk away from her without doing anything. Hoping that doesn't bite me in the butt. :o
The after pics suggest you could have lowered the heels even more, especially considering the amount of rotation the vet told you the pony has. By the way it's save to call a +15 degree rotation a high end laminitis case. If your worked help a high end laminitis case pull through you did a good job!

Do keep in mind that realigning P3 is vital. Work towards a straight HPA, raise heels to reduce DDFT pull and bring back break over as much as your capacities allow you. Don't forget to add hoofpack at the posterior part of the foot.

Thank you for your clear and precise explanations and insight. Hoof in hand I thought I took the heels back as much as I could. But then looking at the photos at home, I thought I could have possibly taken more. With both you and Gabino saying the same, I will feel much more confident in doing that when I see her next. Thanks again!!
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RE:Gypsy- Foundered pony 25 Feb 2011 12:06 #7

  • Lori McBride
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Just a quick update on Gypsy. Saw her yesterday, was at the barn shoeing some other horses. She was turned out in the indoor arena, was trotting around and at one point cantering up to the gate. Totally different horse than she was eight weeks ago. Body relaxed, head and ears up, seemed to be happy. Still trying to get some rads at the re set. But because she is feeling so good her owners don't think I need them. :rolleyes: I just keep telling them we got really lucky. :o So we'll see.........thanks again for the advise Ron and Gabino.
Lori McBride CF
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RE:Gypsy- Foundered pony 25 Feb 2011 15:22 #8

  • mwmyersdvm
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Elizabeth81 wrote:
Just a quick update on Gypsy. Saw her yesterday, was at the barn shoeing some other horses. She was turned out in the indoor arena, was trotting around and at one point cantering up to the gate. Totally different horse than she was eight weeks ago. Body relaxed, head and ears up, seemed to be happy. Still trying to get some rads at the re set. But because she is feeling so good her owners don't think I need them. :rolleyes: I just keep telling them we got really lucky. :o So we'll see.........thanks again for the advise Ron and Gabino.

You may show the owners my input as it is from a veterinarian who has no monetary gain to expect from the case. Radiographs are critical to long term success in laminitic cases. They will show where changes can be made in trim and shoeing cycles before the pony crashes and you cannot recover her. So far, you are quite correct, this pony has been very lucky and you have done an excellent job visually. However, if your luck runs out, the pony may be lost even if radiogrpahs are brought in to salvage the case at that point. Handling lamintic cases correctly is not an inexpensive situation. While these owners may hear of miraculous 'cures' with simplistic methods, these are a few positive outcomes from people usually having something to gain from the use of their methods and they don't publish their failures.

M. W. Myers, D.V.M.
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RE:Gypsy- Foundered pony 01 Sep 2011 00:27 #9

  • Lori McBride
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Just thought I would update on Gypsy. She is currently happy and relatively sound. However, we have had some ups and downs. I had a very discouraging moment back in the end of May. :(
The owners thought that it would be OK to turn Gypsy out on pasture. I never even thought that they would consider doing such a thing, or I would have screamed DON'T!!! But since she hadn't been on grass in over a year (and we had a particularly wet and lush spring so founder in general was rampant) and they turned her out for a few hours a few days in a row, yes she had a laminitic attack. The vet was called and has been at every shoeing since, so that is a blessing. However it was a very sad thing to see her go back to being in pain, when it so easily could have been avoided.

There didn't seem to be any new rotation, and her sole depth was still very decent. I have struggled since the last laminitic episode to find the right balance to strike. I feel the heels are still a little tall and she is still in wedges on both sides. However, if I get too aggressive her DDFT swells, and she is uncomfortable. The last two resets, she has only continued to improve. Almost back to where we had her in the spring. Would love the thoughts and critique from the many of you who far surpass me in experience. Thanks so much!!
Lori McBride CF
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RE:Gypsy- Foundered pony 01 Sep 2011 01:49 #10

  • Gary Hill
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Great looking work, but I would fit alot fuller behind the bulbs for more support. It looks like a small foot to start? Thats what I would do ...Good Luck!:D
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
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