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TOPIC: Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays.

RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 12 Oct 2009 19:53 #16

  • cynthia-jay
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I have seen Vets "unsure" to tell if a hoof is club or not with an X-ray

I would definately recomend an X-ray for something Ronald has presented as an example, and other instances that require it

l@@k ahead if you come across that, for compensation in the other 3

as for general "overall balance" I sight them in as stated/pay attention to the rear of the horse as well

working on charity cases you get alot braver than with a clients horse

as times goes on, you develop your eye, as you pick up each hoof, you should be able to also determine soundness/lameness issues/

warning:
if you tip one over...you went to far :D

have a great day

as always

c jay:)
Cynthia Jay
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shoot first, ask questions later, dead men tell no tails, nor do they tie up the legal system or jails
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 01:54 #17

  • calshoer
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Patty,
I have just one question ( and I don't mean to be smart but I know it'll come across that way but ) wouldn't a ruler be as accurate and easier for finding the widest part of the foot? If not, can you explain why? I know it's obvious from my question but I will admit I'm not well versed in the NB system although I am interested in it.
A ruler would be pretty good IF the sole has a fairly rounded shape, AND the frog apex was not stretched.However because some feet are less symmetrical, (such as round on the lateral side and very straight in the medial side) or have very straight quarters on both sides, (making it hard to see or measure the widest part of the sole) or may have stretched frogs, we use three methods in NB to determine the WP of the foot. Therefore besides just measuring across the sole, we also find the measurement back from the *trimmed* frog apex at its junction with the sole, AND find the termination of the bars at the sole and then use all three. That way if there is any small discrepancy, then you have "the best two out of three" to guide you, sans Xrays .
Patty Stiller CNBF,CLS
www.hoofcareonline.com
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 03:03 #18

  • Gary Hill
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OK, now come on! You have got to be kidding ,if you don't think a simple ruler can't measure "The widest part of the hoof"? A first grader can do that looking at it!:eek:
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 03:22 #19

  • calshoer
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OK, now come on! You have got to be kidding ,if you don't think a simple ruler can't measure "The widest part of the hoof"?
Try reading my post again. :rolleyes:
Patty Stiller CNBF,CLS
www.hoofcareonline.com
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 03:30 #20

  • calshoer
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Take a ruler and find the widest part of this foot,and therefore the COA ,Gary. :D
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Patty Stiller CNBF,CLS
www.hoofcareonline.com
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 03:46 #21

  • Gary Hill
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Can you blow the picture up? I don't have a ruler that small.:D
"As I see it, winners get the money - while losers talk of "individual goals" and similar stuff." Tom Stovall
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 05:43 #22

I Agree with Patty, Works every - time!!! Marc Caldwell's work proves it !!
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 05:48 #23

Gary, come to the Texas Podiatry Conference, This is going to be a once in a life-time chance , Chris Pollitt, Steven O'Grady, Mark Caldwell, Blane Chapman.
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 05:51 #24

ladyblacksmith wrote:
It also depends on WHO is holding the X-ray machine; and what vet is reading the x-rays......in as much.


Where mechanics are concerned I'll do the reading :D


Ronald Aalders
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 06:37 #25

Yep, Ron, How many Bad Rads , have you seen over your years, of shoeing??
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 11:21 #26

For us, as shoers, quality of the pic never really is a problem. We don't need to judge calcifications, coffin bone edges or whatnot to use a rad for our purposes. As long as we can tell where the COA is, as long as we can determine the position of P3 in the hoofcapsule, we're fine.

No rad however poor it may have been was useless to me. However there are generally good quality X rays that are useless to me. How am I going to determine break over en support lenght when a rad is not taken at direct angles? How about measuring sole depth without a decent horizontal/top of the block marker? What should I do with a rad of a laminitic foot in a cradle? And there are more mistakes made that could easily be prevented and would have made my life so much easier.


Ronald Aalders
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 12:33 #27

Ronald Aalders wrote:
Where mechanics are concerned I'll do the reading :D


Ronald Aalders

now, now, that's playing vet.
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 12:48 #28

  • DavidinGA
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Patty,

If I understand what you posted, the NB principles just give more ways of determining the COA so that you will be more likely to accurately find it than if you only used one method ( such as a ruler). Thanks for the explaination, it was very helpfull.

David
David H. Van Hook
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 15:18 #29

ladyblacksmith wrote:
now, now, that's playing vet.

I don't care. I'm bigger than most vets anyway :D

By the way personally I never use the widest part of the foot as a reference to find the COA. I found more than once that especially on very distorted (migrated) hoofcapsules, the COA in my measurements were more precise than when determined with the widest part of the foot reference.


Ronald Aalders
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RE:Finding Center of Articulation...without x rays. 13 Oct 2009 15:24 #30

Ronald Aalders wrote:
I don't care. I'm bigger than most vets anyway :D

By the way personally I never use the widest part of the foot as a reference to find the COA. I found more than once that especially on very distorted (migrated) hoofcapsules, the COA in my measurements were more precise than when determined with the widest part of the foot reference.


Ronald Aalders

very truly said. I was just teasing you nicely of course here at horseshoes.
every thing has variables in it, and you don't use the same methods on a disfigured hoof as you do on a nice hunter type foot.
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