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TOPIC: member benefits

member benefits 28 Jun 2007 04:00 #1

Please take a moment to share your opinion in a quick 2 question survey about your farrier association's benefits. Click here to view: http://app.icontact.com/icp/sub/survey/start?sid=8393&cid=27789
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RE:member benefits 28 Jun 2007 06:17 #2

  • Cyber Farrier
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As everyone knows, I am very cir***spect about posting my opinion regarding any particular subjects. Staying as neutral as possible is essential in my position.

That being said, I do wish to express the following thoughts:

A) The purpose of these forums is to diseminate information and ideas through public discourse, the emphasis being on the word "public." Therefore the posting of a link to a survey located outside these forums, where the results can't be viewed by all, in real time, is disquieting.

B) I understand the purpose of the survey, and applaud the effort to gather this information, which can indeed be useful. But the choices in question 1 of the survey could have been put in a "poll" post, and therefore people could have provided their answers, and everyone would have been able to see the results immediately. Not only would this be useful, it would also generate discussion, which is the purpose of the forums.

C) The second question could simply have been posted as a question asking for an answer, without debate involved. Considering the nature of the information sought, if that post was formulated in that way, I would have made sure the resulting posts stuck to answers, without debate.

D) The request for an email address to verify the person providing the answers is a two edged sword. Yes, it's nice to verify, but on the other hand, asking persons to provide their identity when answering a survey tends to discourage participation. Therefore, if the first question was posted as a poll, people could have voted in anonimity, and if they chose to answer the second question they would be verified automatically because they're registed here.

And those are my thoughts. As I stated at the beginning, the information sought is useful, and therefore the post will remain. I just think it should have utilized a different modus operendi.

Baron
“Suppose you were an ******. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.”
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“There is no distinctly native American criminal class... save Congress.”
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RE:member benefits 28 Jun 2007 11:11 #3

  • Rick Burten
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Well said, Baron!

Equally as disquieting for me is the fact that AFA members have be pilloried for posting about matters concerning the AFA, yet the AFA, in the guise of FarrierFacts comes here in this manner.
Rick Burten PF

In the immortal words of Ron White: "But let me tell you something, folks: You can't fix S-tupid. There's not a pill you can take; there's not a class you can go to. S-tupid is forever."
."


Je pense donc je suis
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RE:member benefits 30 Jun 2007 17:45 #4

Baron & Rick...

Lets get the facts straight. First of all, this not about or for the AFA. It to get info about what farriers feel they would benefit most from by way of their membership in WHATEVER farrier association they belong to.

Baron, I think you should be constantly polling to get more and more accurate data as to how the industry can best serve its tradesman and how owners can best accommodate their beloved farriers.

The request for email addresses is to ensure accuracy and no duplicates in our surveys.

As for FarrierFacts guising (if that's a word) for the AFA...while that's just plain UNfactual.
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RE:member benefits 30 Jun 2007 20:57 #5

  • Rick Burten
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www.FarrierFacts.com wrote:
Baron & Rick...

Lets get the facts straight. First of all, this not about or for the AFA. It to get info about what farriers feel they would benefit most from by way of their membership in WHATEVER farrier association they belong to.
As Mr. Stovall might say "Hot Damn I love a conspiracy." Lets do indeed get the facts straight. Once before FF came amongst us on these forums and was operating as an agent for the AFA. The President-elect of the AFA, Mr. Andrew Elsbree has an (ahem) int-i-m-ate connection with FF. Mr. Elsbree along with some others in leadership positions in the AFA has made public statements, most generally, negative, regarding AFA members participating on these forums when the subject matter involves the AFA. Demonstrably, the subject of this latest survey, involves the AFA. What conclusions would you draw?
Baron, I think you should be constantly polling to get more and more accurate data as to how the industry can best serve its tradesman and how owners can best accommodate their beloved farriers.
Why? That has never been either the intent or purpose of these forums, though Baron graciously allows polls to be undertaken on the FHRC(horseshoes.com) , when the subject matter is appropriate. In point of fact, Baron has bent over backwards to be accomodating to farriers, veterinarians, horse owners and other interested parties. Attempting to chastise him is a fool's errand.
The request for email addresses is to ensure accuracy and no duplicates in our surveys.
Then you should find a different way to validate your surveys.
As for FarrierFacts guising (if that's a word) for the AFA...while that's just plain UNfactual.
While "guising" may not be a word, had you done your due dilligence you would have learned the following:

"Guise


Syllables: guise
Part of Speech noun
View pronunciation guide Pronunciation "gaiz"

Definition 1. external appearance, esp. if deceptive.
Example a swindler under the guise of a friendly neighbor.
Synonyms semblance (1) , exterior (2) , disguise (2) , masquerade
Similar Words face , cover , front , pretense , look , appearance"

As for the rest of it, the facts speak for themselves, including the fact of past acts.
Rick Burten PF

In the immortal words of Ron White: "But let me tell you something, folks: You can't fix S-tupid. There's not a pill you can take; there's not a class you can go to. S-tupid is forever."
."


Je pense donc je suis
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RE:member benefits 30 Jun 2007 22:32 #6

Baron,

Didn't you make it a requirement that anyone posting in the political section was required to post with a full disclosure of their identity either in their log in or their signature? :confused: In this case I see neither and according you your most tolerant rules the posts not signed should have been removed, or has your most magnificent and benevolent dictator changed the rules again?
Ronald E. Kramedjian, RJF

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"What is popular is not always right; what is right is not always popular." Unknown

"In matters of style swim with the current; In matters of principle, stand like a...
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RE:member benefits 30 Jun 2007 23:34 #7

  • Cyber Farrier
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www.FarrierFacts.com wrote:
Baron & Rick...

Lets get the facts straight. First of all, this not about or for the AFA. It to get info about what farriers feel they would benefit most from by way of their membership in WHATEVER farrier association they belong to.
I agree completely. Any information gathered in that regard, by anyone or any organization, if it's to be utilized in a productive manner, is applauded by me. I never spoke a word against gathering such information. It was methodology that I questioned.
Baron, I think you should be constantly polling to get more and more accurate data as to how the industry can best serve its tradesman and how owners can best accommodate their beloved farriers.
As has already been pointed out by Rick, my function is to provide the venue and keep some semblance of order. It is for others to gather and/or diseminate information.
The request for email addresses is to ensure accuracy and no duplicates in our surveys.
I know why. All I did was point out the possible deleterious effect of such a request, and how it could have been avoided.
FarrierFacts guising (if that's a word) for the AFA... while that's just plain UNfactual.
I never inferred as much, nor do I do so now.

It has been correctly pointed out by Ron that the rules for the Political Arena Forum require that all posts be signed with the posters real name. Even if you represent a company or organization, the name is still required. I'd appreciate it if you'd comply in the future. Your posts are encouraged.

Baron
“Suppose you were an ******. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself.”
- Mark Twain

“There is no distinctly native American criminal class... save Congress.”
-Mark Twain

“No man's life, liberty, or property is safe...
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RE:member benefits 02 Jul 2007 00:57 #8

  • Gary_Miller
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I just took the survey. At the end you get this message.

"Thank you for registering. Your information has been recorded and your subscription request has been received.

You can manage your subscription from every email you receive through this mailing list. Simply click on the "Manage your Subscription" link at the bottom of the message."

What was it I just subscribed to?

What is it that I have to manage?

Why am I being placed on a mailing list I did not ask for?

I sure hope Andrew Elsbree has more openness with the AFA once his term as president starts than he does with his surveys.
Gary Miller, PF

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