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TOPIC: Chosen ones

Chosen ones 27 Dec 2006 05:22 #1

  • shodrite
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;) After all the long winded knocks I've read, I have decided to vote for:
Andrew Elsbree, CJF #3552
Dick Fanguy, CJF #2146

Enough said.................Shodrite,
John E Argus,Jr., CJF #2162
(985)-807-5627
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RE:Chosen ones 27 Dec 2006 17:17 #2

My vote goes to Andrew and Dick also.

AFA member #7480
Member in good standing through 03/01/2007 and planning to renew my membership.

Just a side note to all. Check out the AFA web site on a regular basis. Insurance benefits are available. The members and horse owners discussion forum is more active.
Phil Armitage, CF
AFA member 7480

"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
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RE:Chosen ones 27 Dec 2006 17:27 #3

Out of respect to all candidates i will keep my votes confidential. I think all the candidates have endured enough skepticism, and being under the microscope so to speak seems to be a bit stressful.

Best of luck to all candidates,

Mike White
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RE:Chosen ones 27 Dec 2006 17:41 #4

ranchoblanco wrote:
Out of respect to all candidates i will keep my votes confidential. I think all the candidates have endured enough skepticism, and being under the microscope so to speak seems to be a bit stressful.

Best of luck to all candidates,

Mike White

Good on you Mike. I doubt I will sway the membership or hurt a candidates feelings. I have been told numersous times, you have to have a thick hide. Nobody is going to get any pity from me.
Phil Armitage, CF
AFA member 7480

"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
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RE:Chosen ones 28 Dec 2006 02:04 #5

  • Gary_Miller
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Phil Armitage wrote:
Insurance benefits are available.
Not health care!!!!
Phil Armitage wrote:
The members and horse owners discussion forum is more active.
Not by much!!!!
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Chosen ones 28 Dec 2006 16:56 #6

  • T.N. Trosin
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Gary_Miller wrote:
Not health care!!!!

Just a note about health care here.

I remind the AFA membership that a health care package was offered to the AFA general membership, who for varrious reasons failed to sign up. The offer made and there were two subsiquent extentions with no further sign ups past the inital ones, at which point the board decided to drop the program because of a lack of intrest.
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RE:Chosen ones 29 Dec 2006 00:13 #7

  • Gary_Miller
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Tom, Thanks I was aware of the program and that it was dropped due to the lack of participation.

Was any survey taken in order to find out why there was a lack of participation?

I know for me I have health care through my military retirement so did not even look into the plan.

I also know that there where some problems in some areas where the insurance was not good after one year do to state laws. Or something like that. Not really sure the details just heard one of the guys in this area talking along those lines. Maybe someone else knows what I speaking of. If not I will try and find out the details.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Chosen ones 29 Dec 2006 03:29 #8

  • T.N. Trosin
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Gary:

I don't know if there was ever a survey taken. I would think that the best person to ask would be Jeff Ridley, where as it was a program he did extensive work on.
T
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RE:Chosen ones 29 Dec 2006 03:36 #9

  • George Geist
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Guys,
Biggest problem with their medical as I understand it is that it is not available in all 50 states.

The reason for the low participation was simply because it was too much money. The medical plan the Union has (although it IS available in all 50 states) also has low participation for the same reason.

Until this country establishes some kind of public health service, or extends medicare to cover everybody, this problem will only continue to get worse.
George
For another fun place to play........
www.horseshoersforum.invisionzone.com
Come over and say hello.
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RE:Chosen ones 29 Dec 2006 04:35 #10

  • jvzieger
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Guys/Gals,

I just have to chime in on the health care thing. I did not work with Jeff Ridley on the original plan offering, and I don't know the details of it, but I am on the current membership benefits committee and we have looked into this some more, recently.

Because the AFA is a national (actually international) organization, and this country has no standardized health care plans, the task at hand to provide health insurance would be so incredibly large and complex, it's nearly insurmountable.

The first problem is the healthcare plans being on a state by state basis. Many plans will not work effectively in any other state other than the state of origin. Managing the many plans that would be required would necessitate hiring a full time health care benefit administration department.

The next HUGE problem is the cost of a decent plan. Even with 3000 members IF we could get EVERY member to sign up, that’s still not a very big employee pool compared to what the insurance companies require for a substantial discount, so the cost of the plan to the member would barely be any better than what they could find on the free market locally as an individual. Also, we are NOT going to get large numbers of the membership to sign up because many have insurance by another means (such as is the case with me, where my wife is a teacher with great insurance for us both).

I agree that a decent health care plan would be one of the best benefits the AFA could offer, and I would sincerely like to be able to bring that to the membership. If there are any members that are knowledgeable on this subject and they feel my conclusions are not accurate, I welcome those members to contact me directly anytime to discuss realistic ideas to pull a plan together. Unfortunately, since healthcare is one of the largest social failings of this country, I don’t think we are going to develop a real solution here, but I still remain open minded.
:)
Jim Zieger Farrier
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RE:Chosen ones 29 Dec 2006 05:07 #11

  • Rick Burten
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Jim,

As you are now on the committee that is trying to deal with this issue, perhaps you'd explain to everyone why the original plan failed. I have the "outline" of what happened but I hope you can flesh this out so that everyone has a better understanding of the difficulties involved in trying to bring the concept to fruition.
Rick Burten PF

In the immortal words of Ron White: "But let me tell you something, folks: You can't fix S-tupid. There's not a pill you can take; there's not a class you can go to. S-tupid is forever."
."


Je pense donc je suis
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RE:Chosen ones 31 Dec 2006 05:58 #12

As the chair of the member services committee I would like to say that we are not currently pursuing health insurance benefits. Jeff Ridley and his team spent nearly 2 years coming up with the program they offered, only to have it fail. I think there were several reasons for this. First of all, we do not know how many AFA members buy their own health insurance. As Jim Z pointed out, some farriers are insured through their spouse's program. Also, it is my understanding that policies written for associations (as opposed to businesses or unions) have fewer mandatory coverages. This makes these policies unacceptable in many states and therefore unavailable (states decide what types of policies they allow to be sold to their residents). Since I do purchase my own insurance, I looked at what Jeff Ridley (and the office) was able to offer. The price of the policy the AFA offered was slightly less than what I was paying, but not that much. I decided that I felt more comfortable doing business with a company that was local and I was familiar with.

All that being said, the lack of a health care system in the United States is a far bigger issue than we few AFA members are going to solve. Health insurance is very important and we each must take the responsibility of making sure we have coverage that will be there when we need it. We're an independent bunch of folks....we can do that!

Sincerely,
Nancy Zwicker
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RE:Chosen ones 31 Dec 2006 13:35 #13

  • reillyshoe
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Nancy,
If you were approaching the insurance companies representing 10,000-20,000 farriers nation wide would the cost difference be much more attractive than what a farrier could get on their own?

Thanks,
Pat Reilly
P
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RE:Chosen ones 31 Dec 2006 14:25 #14

  • Gary_Miller
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N Zwicker wrote:
As the chair of the member services committee I would like to say that we are not currently pursuing health insurance benefits.
The most sought after benefit in the country and we (the AFA) are not pursuing it?N Zwicker wrote:
Jeff Ridley and his team spent nearly 2 years coming up with the program they offered, only to have it fail.
Why did it fail?N Zwicker wrote:
I think there were several reasons for this. First of all, we do not know how many AFA members buy their own health insurance. As Jim Z pointed out, some farriers are insured through their spouse's program.
A well put togeather survey of the membership would quickly reveal this.N Zwicker wrote:
Also, it is my understanding that policies written for associations (as opposed to businesses or unions) have fewer mandatory coverages. This makes these policies unacceptable in many states and therefore unavailable (states decide what types of policies they allow to be sold to their residents).
Then we would have to have a company that could write policies for each state. This coulds mean that the cost could be diffrent depending on the requirements for the state.N Zwicker wrote:
All that being said, the lack of a health care system in the United States
Since when did the US lack a health care system?N Zwicker wrote:
is a far bigger issue than we few AFA members are going to solve.
Were not tring to fix the health care system only find a reasonable health insurance program for farriers and families.N Zwicker wrote:
Health insurance is very important and we each must take the responsibility of making sure we have coverage that will be there when we need it. We're an independent bunch of folks....we can do that!
Your so right here, and we can all go out and get a health insurance program tomarrow. Many companies have programs for self employeed individuals. However, the idea being able to have insurance available as a benifit for AFA members is you can usually get a better program at a better price if you have more people on the program.

This issue is so important to all farriers that not only should it be on the "Members Services Committees" agenda. It should be its number one priority.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Chosen ones 31 Dec 2006 14:48 #15

Come on Gary, this type of hard questioning is tireing. It underminds the hard honest efforts of those involved with that issue. To start your survey I can speak for myself. I did recieve the insurance info. from the AFA, cho0se not to sign up for it. Because my wifes policy covers the whole family 100% through her work. I have looked into policys for self employed if the day comes we need to pay for it. Group policys are available for self employed. I also think rates and benefits differ from state to state. I can see where an Association like the AFA might not be able to compete with what is already available to us as self employed out there.
Phil Armitage, CF
AFA member 7480

"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
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