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TOPIC: Took the boss's hint...New thread

RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 04:17 #91

scruggs1 wrote:
You pretty much nailed it. We also have all types of horse owners...those that compete at high levels tend to have the high level farriers. Those who don't know any better tend to use those farriers who don't know any better either. It really works itself out in that regard. The best customers do their job, let the trainer do his/her job, let the farrier do his/hers, and the vet do his/hers. The worst get caught up in all the hype and fads, then try to get us to do that **** to their horse. Just curious if along with licensing comes customer confidence in your knowledge and abilities, or do you have those over there who know more about how to shoe their horse than you do?

I think those same "farrier" will be shoeing the same horses regardless of any licensing law. They'd just be doing it without a license. As it is, I'd bet that most of them aren't paying income tax on the money they earn shoeing horses. What's one more little law to break. if a guy doesn't mind crossing the Internal Revenue Service, a little thing like a license isn't going to stop him.
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 06:11 #92

  • Rick Talbert
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The prospect of licensing does not bother me because every farrier would get grandfathered in. It wouldn't really change anything. Its probably not enforceable here because demand is too high. I don't care one way or the other. I do admire our freedom and I admire England's standards, both systems work. Whatever. But I was glad to read that Mike and txfarrier know their history when it comes to the war of northern aggression. Right on fellows.
Rick Talbert
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 07:29 #93

  • SlowShoe
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BS-Horseshoeing wrote:
Mike, if the government did push through a standardized certification test and licensing what would you do?

Black market horseshoeing. That's where I would be.

You see just as much crappy shoeing in areas with 'regulation' as you do in the US.
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 07:31 #94

  • SlowShoe
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Rick Talbert wrote:
But I was glad to read that Mike and txfarrier know their history when it comes to the war of northern aggression. Right on fellows.

I didnt read there posts, but to be fair the Rebs attacked the Yanks first. Now it was probably their right to as the Union was essentially now camped out on their property.

Now I dont think that was license for Sherman to commit the sort of war crimes he did during his march to the sea.
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 07:43 #95

  • SlowShoe
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Anthony_Lawrence wrote:
I think it is important to make the distinction between corporate/bureaucratic America and ordinary folks. For we outsiders, there is much to despise about the former, but I will defend most ordinary Americans as some of the most wonderful people on the planet.

I am waiting for the day when these people reclaim their country. ;)


The US Constitution allows for states to succeed from the union if they want to.

Those who tell you the war was over slavery dont really know what their talking about. It was over succession from Federal power. Thats about it. To prove this point you only have to look at the fact that slavery was ONLY outlawed in the southern states and not the northern states during the war. There were still slave states in the union. Also history records many many comments and notes written by President Lincoln suggesting that he thought black and white people were not equals at all. Basically he was just as racist as the rest of them.

History loves to idolize people. Christopher Columbus not only discovered America, but he was also a mass murderer and slave trader directly responsible for the extinction of entire ethnic groups. Yet Americans love the guy.
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 13:54 #96

  • DavidinGA
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brian robertson wrote:
Historical footnote: Pres. Lincoln asked for and Congress passed legislation establishing the FIRST income tax in the US, in the fall of 1861, as a form of war funding , AFTER the start of the war. But hey, don't let the facts get in the way of what you believe

That's because the tax system before the Civil War was based on how much land you owned. In the pre civil war tax system, it didn't matter how much money you made each year, there was a set amount per acre that you had to pay in taxes. Most southerners owed more taxes each year than they made during the year. Where as most northerners who paid taxes, owned less than 5 acres and were making bundles off those acres by putting businesses on them.

The facts are readily available that the American Taxation system was the major cause of the Civil War. The only reason slavery was brought into the issue was because Congress wanted to punish southerners for the cost of the war. If you study the history of the time you will find the Lincoln didn't want to sign the Emancipation Proclamation because he was afraid that the rest of the world would think the war was over slavery.

This issue also had a lot to do with why Robert E. Lee gave up his commission in the Union Army to serve in the Confederacy. His family had a history, back to his Grandfather ( known as Lite Horse Harry ) of fighting the American taxation system because it was prejudiced against the southern landowner. In fact, the income tax system we have today is largely based on the system suggested by Harry Lee immediately after the Revolution.


David
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 14:00 #97

  • DavidinGA
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SlowShoe wrote:
The US Constitution allows for states to succeed from the union if they want to.

Those who tell you the war was over slavery dont really know what their talking about. It was over succession from Federal power. Thats about it. To prove this point you only have to look at the fact that slavery was ONLY outlawed in the southern states and not the northern states during the war. There were still slave states in the union. Also history records many many comments and notes written by President Lincoln suggesting that he thought black and white people were not equals at all. Basically he was just as racist as the rest of them.

History loves to idolize people. Christopher Columbus not only discovered America, but he was also a mass murderer and slave trader directly responsible for the extinction of entire ethnic groups. Yet Americans love the guy.

In one of Lincoln's more famous speeches, he said plainly that he thought blacks were a lower life form than whites and that they should never be integrated to white society. I think that makes it pretty clear he was racist. In fact, he was so racist that, at the end of the war he purchased an entire country in Africa and began shipping blacks "back" to Africa. Even though most of the people he shipped to Africa were 3rd or 4th Generation Americans who had no desire to go to Africa.

Look up Liberia and it's history.

David
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 14:30 #98

  • Mike Ferrara
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Slavery was made an issue because it was a key difference between the north and the south. Generally, you hate somebody over some alleged difference.

While the northern states didn't have slaves at the time, they had hoards of immigrants who lived and worked in horrible conditions to drive their economy. Most of the slaves in the south were probably treated better. Lets hear it for the moral north.

The real driving factors were related to the difference between the northern and southers economies (industrial vs agriculture) and the inequality of representation in congress due to the more urban, more populated nature of the north vs the more rural, less populated nature of the south.

The south wanted a slave to be counted as a person which would get them more reps in the house. It was the north who insisted that slaves were NOT people. They compromised and decided that a slave was 3/5 a person?

Then as now, it was the federal government was trying to force one size to fit all in the interests of a select group. The select group was the industrial giants that provided them the money they needed to live like rock stars.

The fight isn't over. We continue the very same fight as the likes of Pelosi (elected by people in California to serve California interests) tries to force us all (I don't even get to vote against her) to have the kind of insurance that she wants us to have.

I hope Charlie Danials is right when he sings The South's is Gonna do it Again"
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 15:53 #99

  • cuttinshoer
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SlowShoe wrote:
Now I dont think that was license for Sherman to commit the sort of war crimes he did during his march to the sea.

It's a war for chris sake. War crimes that is the ******est thing I have ever heard. If this country would follow Sherman's ways a little more seriously these days things would a lot different. Total annihilation is not a war crime it's war.
Justin Decker

"As I see it, good enough is never good enough, it's just an excuse for mediocrity. If every shoeing ain't worth your best shot, you're just going through the motions." Tom Stovall, CJF
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 17:37 #100

  • SlowShoe
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cuttinshoer wrote:
It's a war for chris sake. War crimes that is the ******est thing I have ever heard. If this country would follow Sherman's ways a little more seriously these days things would a lot different. Total annihilation is not a war crime it's war.


When targeting the civilian population and the infrastructure, then thats questionable. But i have to admit my use of the words 'war crimes' or whatever I said was probably not right. I was under the impression he had killed amounts of the Southern civilian population. I dont know where I thought I read it but I couldnt find any information on it just now. So its probably wrong info. Obviously I have too much time on my hands, I got to go shoe some horses now. ;)
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 18:29 #101

  • cuttinshoer
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SlowShoe wrote:
When targeting the civilian population and the infrastructure, then thats questionable. But i have to admit my use of the words 'war crimes' or whatever I said was probably not right. I was under the impression he had killed amounts of the Southern civilian population. I dont know where I thought I read it but I couldnt find any information on it just now. So its probably wrong info. Obviously I have too much time on my hands, I got to go shoe some horses now. ;)

Everyone has there own beleifs. It's a war, that means people get killed and things get destroyed. The devastation of infastructure is key in limiting the power of the opposing forces. In the type of war we are engaged in now how does one tell the difference between civilian and soldier, when you don't even know who you are fighting.

Sherman's methods ended the civil war, how many soldiers would have lost there lives if the war would have continued, compared to the loss of the civilian population.

Similar methods also ended World War II. Politicaly correctness will be the end of us IMO.
Justin Decker

"As I see it, good enough is never good enough, it's just an excuse for mediocrity. If every shoeing ain't worth your best shot, you're just going through the motions." Tom Stovall, CJF
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 13 Dec 2010 20:41 #102

  • Jack Evers
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I've heard that Sherman once said "War is hell, and the worse it is, the sooner it's over". The Civil war lasted about three years, WW1 about three years, WW 2 about 5 years, Now things drag on and on. If France and England had sent "peace keepers" over here for the Civil war, they'd probably still be here.
Jack Evers CJF AFA#426

The best things about the good old days -- I wasn't good and I wasn't old.

The older I get, the more horses I shoe, the fewer things that I can absolutely, positively fix.
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 14 Dec 2010 00:21 #103

  • SlowShoe
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War sucks. Killing people should never be taken lightly either way. There are too many "what if's" for every situation.

The at least 5 wars the US is involved in now, the US should not be in.

-josh
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 14 Dec 2010 02:14 #104

  • cuttinshoer
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SlowShoe wrote:
War sucks. Killing people should never be taken lightly either way. There are too many "what if's" for every situation.

The at least 5 wars the US is involved in now, the US should not be in.

-josh

Yep, they should already be over with.
Justin Decker

"As I see it, good enough is never good enough, it's just an excuse for mediocrity. If every shoeing ain't worth your best shot, you're just going through the motions." Tom Stovall, CJF
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RE:Took the boss's hint...New thread 14 Dec 2010 04:15 #105

  • SlowShoe
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cuttinshoer wrote:
Yep, they should already be over with.

Well we should have never been in any of those places in the first place. But that's for another discussion.
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