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TOPIC: Improvement Clinics held for all organizations

RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 02:47 #16

Rick Talbert wrote:
The differences in how these groups evaluate and define a good shoeing job, makes a co-sponsored event between two or more of these groups you mentioned seem unlikely. Not impossible, but unlikely IMO. Kinda like having a conference co-sponsored by catholics, baptists, and buddhists. I think the most active group providing the type of learning experience you described is the state chapters of the AFA. In most states these guys are eager to help others and will put on a clinic whenever or where-ever they can.
I have been to 5 AFA Pre-certification clinics, and they were all just as you described you would like. Everyone is made welcome and comfortable. I think certification is "relevent" to most farriers, regardless of what they claim, or what excuses they make. There will always be cases of sour grapes, or cases where people have a hard time accepting reality. There will also be those who turn against the certification process simply out of an inability to master their own fear of failure. But I think most people find that the anticipation of being tested is worse than the actual testing itself. Exposing yourself to it a few times will allow all those pre-conceived notions to subside, and you realize that there are very good farriers at each cert. who fail, laugh it off, and try again, and again if neccesary. If it were easy everyone would do it and it wouldn't mean as much. You say testing makes people nervous. Did taking tests in school make people nervous? I guess it is all in how you approach it and what expectations you put on yourself. When I took my certified test I was very nervous for some reason, but ever since then, I've approached things with a sense of humor, (and probably not as prepared as I should be) with an "okay, I'll have a go at it" philosophy. I've learned to laugh at myself and not take things so seriously. Shoeing the horse for the journeyman in the alotted amount of time has been difficult for me, but it'd help if I shod horses with handmades more than once in a blue moon. But do I blame the test, or the examiners, ... nope, its all on me! I do know if I buckle down and practice a little it is attainable, so no sour grapes here.:o If I were not such a lazy bugger I'd be out there practicin now instead of lying in the bed tellin others how to go about it, lol. ......maybe i will go light the forge :)
I am Totally with you, Rick, but we have too much in common. It's just strange to me that , someone , that has gone through the process, of certification, has the same view, as myself. And everyone , that has not completed it, throws out that it is Irrelevant, Useless, Wasted-Time, and too Political, Why do you think that is????
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 03:21 #17

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Jake Whitman wrote:
Hey, Gary , After all of that Rant - Against the AFA,
I'm not against the AFA. I just don't feel it does everything that some people within the AFA professes it does.

Jake Whitman wrote:
Should't it be up to the Individual, to seek more knowledge???
It all up to the individual, no one else can do it for you.

Jake Whitman wrote:
Did you EVER Hear that the AFA , had ALL of the Answers??
I have never heard anyone say that. Nor have I ever said the AFA felt like they had all the answers. I don't think anyone organization or individual has all the answers.

Jake Whitman wrote:
Do you think that the AFA, and their programs, do not have something to offer ?
The AFA convention and the certification are both good programs which have something to offer. Its just to bad its the only programs they have to offer.

Jake Whitman wrote:
Do you think that those individuals , that have given - themselves , to this trade, are irrelevant??
No the individuals are not irrelevant. The AFA is irrelevant.

Jake Whitman wrote:
Where do you see Knowledge - Passed down , to New guys comming from??
From the individuals in the trade who are willing to share their knowledge and skills with others.

Jake Whitman wrote:
The latest Issue of the AFJ???
The AFJ is just one source of knowledge. This site is also full of knowledge. There is lots of good knowledge out there all one has to do is look for it.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 03:35 #18

Gary_Miller wrote:
I'm not against the AFA. I just don't feel it does everything that some people within the AFA professes it does.

It all up to the individual, no one else can do it for you.

I have never heard anyone say that. Nor have I ever said the AFA felt like they had all the answers. I don't think anyone organization or individual has all the answers.

The AFA convention and the certification are both good programs which have something to offer. Its just to bad its the only programs they have to offer.

No the individuals are not irrelevant. The AFA is irrelevant.

From the individuals in the trade who are willing to share their knowledge and skills with others.

The AFJ is just one source of knowledge. This site is also full of knowledge. There is lots of good knowledge out there all one has to do is look for it.
That is a direct - Slap -in the Face , to the people that have busted their A**es -off , and then given back , to guys, like you and I. And then in the next breath , you expect them to give something to you.
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 03:37 #19

No wonder Guy's get grumpy about SH**!!!
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 03:50 #20

ms. linda, its not about clubs and affiliations. you need to be around the right kind of people.in weatherford texas,if you know the right folks on any given night you can shoe a horse with a world class plater,putting on handmade shoes forged by a champion blacksmith as an afacjfcnbls comments and instructs.seek out wise people.-gary
Gary W. Atchison-Mustang Farrier Service-Hillsboro Texas
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 03:52 #21

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Jake Whitman wrote:
That is a direct - Slap -in the Face , to the people that have busted their A**es -off , and then given back , to guys, like you and I.
I give all the credit to the individual who has spent their time in learning the trade, profecting what they have learned and the taking their time to teach others at clinics put on by local associations. And you call it a slap in their face, because I refuse to give the AFA the credit for what these individuals have done on their own. Go figure.

Jake Whitman wrote:
And then in the next breath , you expect them to give something to you.
I don't expect any one to give me anything. Never have and never will.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 03:54 #22

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Jake Whitman wrote:
No wonder Guy's get grumpy about SH**!!!
Only when its shoved down the well.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 03:58 #23

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mustang farrier service wrote:
ms. linda, its not about clubs and affiliations. you need to be around the right kind of people.in weatherford texas,if you know the right folks on any given night you can shoe a horse with a world class plater,putting on handmade shoes forged by a champion blacksmith as an afacjfcnbls comments and instructs.seek out wise people.-gary
Gary this is exactly what I have been ranting about. Its not the organizations it the individuals in the trade who make the difference, and a lot of them don't have any letters behind their name, they have the education and are willing to share it.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 04:03 #24

Gary_Miller wrote:
Gary this is exactly what I have been ranting about. Its not the organizations it the individuals in the trade who make the difference, and a lot of them don't have any letters behind their name, they have the education and are willing to share it.
Gary, Please Enlighten us all as to where these individuals get knowledge?? Do they get it on there own??? or do they get it from like-minded, people, willing to share their knowledge with others????
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 04:05 #25

And how many of them had some inflluence , from some CJF,, along the way???
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 04:28 #26

jake whitman is top of the line.he would do anything in the world to help me.if his certs said k-mart on them i would applaud k-mart for helping jake be the man he is.the certs are something to be proud of, and represent to me a true commitment at being the best you can be. the man makes the org. not the other way round.any group that helps people to get better is a good thing.if someone shares their knowlege and skills with me,i am honored. how they came to have this knowledge is not my concern.most of the time however cf or cjf is at the end of their names.-gary
Gary W. Atchison-Mustang Farrier Service-Hillsboro Texas
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 04:32 #27

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Jake Whitman wrote:
Gary, Please Enlighten us all as to where these individuals get knowledge?? Do they get it on there own??? or do they get it from like-minded, people, willing to share their knowledge with others????
The get it from like minded people willing to share their knowledge.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 04:42 #28

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Jake Whitman wrote:
And how many of them had some inflluence , from some CJF,, along the way???
How many of them had some influence from someone who was not a CJF? Before CJF was even available? Before the AFA was even an organization?

Jake, I still don't think you get it. Its not the organization that makes the individual. An organization is only a group of people who share the same interest and have a desire to get together and discuss/share that interest.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 04:45 #29

Gary_Miller wrote:
The get it from like minded people willing to share their knowledge.
And what do most of those like-minded people have in common??? The AFA and many of it's members believe that education passed down from veteran shoers that have some sort of knowledge, is important to our trade. It does no good to any of us if we are bad-mouthing each other. the only way that each of us can learn and grow in our profession is by sharing knowledge.
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RE:Improvement Clinics held for all organizations 23 Mar 2009 04:54 #30

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Jake Whitman wrote:
And what do most of those like-minded people have in common???
A desire to learn and improve.

Jake Whitman wrote:
The AFA and many of it's members believe that education passed down from veteran shoers that have some sort of knowledge, is important to our trade.
The AFA. Howeve, there is just as many in the BWF, the HSU and who don't belong to anything who believe the same thing.

Jake Whitman wrote:
It does no good to any of us if we are bad-mouthing each other. the only way that each of us can learn and grow in our profession is by sharing knowledge.
No one has bad mouthed anyone that I know of.
Gary Miller, PF

Ride hard, shoot straight, and always speak the truth.
Gunfighter Motto

"Our level of quality is how well our eye can see it." (Eric Russell, Oct 2008, Horseshoes.com)

"Discover what it is that makes you passionate then grab a firm...
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