make up natural cara make up make up tutorial make up korea make up minimalis make up artis make up mata belajar make up make up wardah alat make up makeup forever indonesia makeup artist jakarta tips make up barbie make up natural make up make up wajah make up pesta make up syahrini makeup mata makeup minimalis peralatan make up make up cantik make up mac make up kit jual make up make up sederhana perlengkapan make up gambar make up vidio make up cara makeup minimalis wardah make up make up pac make up glamour cara memakai makeup make up panggung harga make up make up modern make up alami make up dasar pixy make up make up muslimah make up oriflame make up jepang makeover cosmetic make up ultima make up sariayu grosir make up makeup fantasi makeup pesta tas makeup langkah make up make up pria make up malam alat makeup tahapan make up produk make up shading make up mak up make up kebaya make up jilbab make up inez make up simpel contoh make up cara ber makeup makeup wajah tanpa make up make up terbaru toko make up mac makeup indonesia make up soft urutan make up trik make up makeover makeup brand gusnaldi make up paket make up panduan make up jual makeup brush make up bagus alat2 make up make up gusnaldi aplikasi make up alat alat makeup dasar make up inez make up peralatan makeup make up wanita make up berjilbab make up tebal sejarah make up make up maybeline make up branded make up siang tata cara makeup reseller make up make up muslim make up maybelin warna make up tips make up artist rias make up make up mata make up artis belajar make up make up artist kursus make up kuas make up make up forever indonesia jual make up mac indonesia make up make up artist indonesia harga make up forever jual make up online make up pac make up forever jakarta make up oriflame jual make up forever make up online shop indonesia harga make up sekolah make up grosir make up harga make up maybelline jual make up murah make up terbaru mak up mac make up indonesia sofia make up make up kit murah mac makeup indonesia produk make up jual make up kit make up store indonesia make up forever academy jakarta toko make up online jual make up set jual make up mac make up beauty jual make up branded produk make up mac make up forever harga make up mac indonesia produk make up artis jual make up palette produk make up forever make up palette murah before after make up pengantin before after make up sendiri before n after hasil makeup contoh make up karakter contoh riasan pengantin before n after harga make up wisuda harga make up artist harga make up forever make up wisuda rias wisuda di jogja Daftar harga make up forever daftar harga make up mac daftar harga kosmetik make up forever makeup wisuda harga makeup wisuda kursus make up di yogyakarta kursus make up di jogja kursus make up jogja kursus make up yogyakarta kursus kecantikan di yogyakarta kursus kecantikan di jogja kursus make up artist di jogja kursus rias pengantin di jogja kursus rias di yogyakarta kursus tata rias di yogyakarta rias pengantin muslim jogja jasa kreasi jilbab wisuda yogyakarta jasa rias make up wisuda murah bagus bisa dpanggil tempat make uf di jigja yang bagus rias wisuda murah dan berkualitas yogyakarta pakar kreasi jilbab di jogja make uper natural yogya make up wisuda hijab area jogja make up dan kreasi jilbab yang bagus di jogja jasa make up natural untuk wisuda jogja makeup jogja make up jogja makeup yogyakarta make up yogyakarta makeup wisuda jogja make up wisuda jogja make up wisuda yogyakarta makeup wisuda yogyakarta
Wednesday June 29, 2022
Welcome, Guest
Username: Password: Remember me
  • Page:
  • 1
  • 2

TOPIC: Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY?

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 01 Feb 2009 14:46 #16

  • Tom Stovall CJF
  • Tom Stovall CJF's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Master
  • Posts: 3882
  • Thank you received: 1
  • Karma: 0
John Corkery in gray, stuff deleted

As oppose to the “Fear Factor” on taking the exams:eek: as Tom S. has suggested and has stated numerous of times on this board.

As I see it, the "fear factor" is evident in anyone who mimics the queen in Hamlet. You can like the AFA tests or not like 'em - no le hace; but, when somebody rants interminably about the AFA's tests like a newly made Sicilian widow, one gets the impression that sour grapes could be the motivation.

Then he and others state that AFA needs to educate the horse owning public of the merits of being AFA certified, well that in it self is VERY simplistic.

Even the AFA test's detractors admit that anyone who takes the time and effort to pass any of the AFA's tests becomes a better farrier in the process. Simplistic or not, becoming a better farrier seems to me to be a worthy goal. It's not the only way to become a better farrier, but it's indisputably one of the ways: What's not to like?

In fact, more of the public has full knowledge of the AFA.


Perhaps in your end of the pond this might be so, but it ain't in Texas. Nobody in the industry knows squat - or cares if they do - about the AFA or the AFA's certification program.

In fact, most horse owner get their opinions from the barn owner, trainer, stable mate, Vet. and finally the farrier. :p

So? Do you think advertisers spend big dough trying to influence folks' buying habits out of altruism?

It has been well known for decades that as a group it has a LOT members purporting that if you want your horses shod right you must use a CJF or your horse will not be shod properly.

Well known by whom? I've seen this nonsense repeated in several quarters, but NEVER by any farrier who has much veterinary custom or by anyone shoeing show, rodeo, race, or performance horses. In fact, I'd hazard a guess that it's most often repeated by folks who are unwilling/unable to test themselves against the AFA's benchmark.

Well I can truthfully say that there a lot of trainers and barn owners that have been the business 10 – 45 yrs and say to me, that they do not appreciate or care to be told, they do not know how their horse should be shod or the results they should expect?

In my experience, while veterinarians and trainers may know what they want want, they don't usually know exactly how to get it done and often find it necessary to hire a farrier to transform their wishes into reality. Does your experience differ?

This is B---S to these folks, they believe the AFA is and always is and always be
nada, rein, Ei-mitaan.

While the needle has been jumping with your every sentence, you just caused my BS meter to redline. The trainers and veterinarians I know would cheerfully hire a card-carrying pedophile on work-release if they thought he could move a horse or fix a basket case. Nobody I know gives a damn about letters after a mechanic's name or his political affiliation if he can get the job done.

As far as their exam goes,( contest prep)


Uh oh, I've got to ask? Did you attempt the exam and fail? Did some mean ol' examiner deflate your fragile ego?

to the folks out here “Due to whatever quirk of nature that sparks them”:rolleyes:
get it done right and have for a long time my friend , is that the best they can do to help the farrier trade,


Does the fact that nobody ever passed any AFA test without becoming a better farrier in the process count as "help to the farrier trade"? If not, why not?

the ONLY reason for the quack system of testing, was to emulate the British and to be able to contest there, PERIOD they never tried to help the system. It was merely for the one’s who wanted to contest there.


As somebody who took and passed the AFA's tests as soon as they were available in Texas, I can state with some authority that your statement is a lie. Not a mistake, not an error, just a plain 'ol baldfaced lie. I know what motivated ME and I took the tests to help ME become a better farrier - and anyone who knows me will attest that I have about as much interest in contesting as fish do bicycles.

Thirty yrs ago, they could have work with the education system here and brought it about.

Over the last 30 years, I've been to a bunch of farrier-related demos, seminars, lectures, wet labs, hammer-ins and clinics - as both student and clinician - and every one of them was sponsored, wholly or in part, by the AFA, AFA members, an AFA affiliated state or regional farrier's association, or an AFA state or regional association's members. Do you see any commonality?

However, no, they prefer to be a loose cannon in the US farrier system and to me they are a bigger part of the problem than a solution that is my view anyhow.


Everyone is entitled to his point of view, but you don't get to make stuff up - as you have - without somebody calling you on it. You may consider yourself called. :)
Tom Stovall, CJF
"The only foolish question is the one left unasked."
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 01 Feb 2009 15:17 #17

Is the AAEP http://www.aaep.org/index.php relevant to the farrier community and horse owners?

I ask this because the first I learned of them was on this forum. Prior to that I have never heard of them. I have owned horses for over 25 years and have had several Vets. work on my horses, none of them mentioned the AAEP. None of my clients in all the years I have been shoeing ever mention the AAEP.

The AAEP's mission statement is very similar to the AFA's mission statement.
Phil Armitage, CF
AFA member 7480

"Anyone who proposes to do good must not expect people to roll stones out of his way, but must accept his lot calmly if they even roll a few more upon it." Albert Schweitzer
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 01 Feb 2009 15:32 #18

  • Rick Burten
  • Rick Burten's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Enforcer
  • Posts: 9082
  • Thank you received: 50
  • Karma: 8
John Corkery wrote:
Hey Rick,

I do not chime in on these discussions and the reason is forth coming in my post.

Quote: “ Many farriers out there that are not AFA members are involved, at least at some level, in a veterinary practice. Due to whatever quirk of nature that sparks them, they have gone the extra mile to learn about those subjects that are encountered in a veterinary practice that require a higher level of knowledge and skills set in order to make themselves valuable to the veterinarian(s).”
Rick that is truly run away pomposity in that statement!

John,

I'm confused :confused::confused:. What in my statement is 'run away pomposity'?
As far as their exam goes,( contest prep) to the folks out here “Due to whatever quirk of nature that sparks them”:rolleyes: get it done right and have for a long time my friend , is that the best they can do to help the farrier trade,

John,

I fear you have misread/misinterpreted my comment(s). I was(and am) saying that in answer to the original question, my answer is "not necessarily or, even, no". And I then went on to expand on that answer.

I'm sorry you did not understand my reply, but I hope that now, taken content in context, you do.

Rick

edited to add, Thanks, Clint, you hit the nail square on the head. :)
Rick Burten PF

In the immortal words of Ron White: "But let me tell you something, folks: You can't fix S-tupid. There's not a pill you can take; there's not a class you can go to. S-tupid is forever."
."


Je pense donc je suis
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 02 Feb 2009 13:38 #19

  • Martin Kenny
  • Martin Kenny's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Contributing Member
  • Posts: 99
  • Karma: 0
OK so here we are.......... Seems that one can look at the 3 threads we have going here and surmise the following...
#1 The AFA must not be relevant to the Farriers, as there has been very little going on in that thread, and what was going on, stated clearly that it was not relevant to those joining in.
#2 The AFA seems to be not relevant at this time in this thread either, but here we see some REALLY good stuff that the AFA should use to help with their process to make it relevant.
#3 The AFA MAY be relevant here, but there is no strong consensus here either.

So lets see how it goes in the upcoming week, maybe we will see some really neat stuff come forth this week............ But PLEASE play nice, as always we have seen the same old group try and bring descent on this type of topic. I for one think it shows one's true character, but even worse than that, it shows one thing that a lot of my clients tell me regularly....."Farriers, as a group, are not professional."

Have a great week ahead, and stay warm. Those going to ICHS, have a great week and learn a lot!
If you feel shoeing horses is best served by how well you can work in the forge, you are missing the point!

It is how well you shoe a horse, so he performs at his best advantage, IN SPITE of his personal issues. Forge work is simply a tool that MAY be...
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 07 Feb 2009 23:09 #20

Re: Rick Burten post #18


Hello Rick,


I am sorry I am so remiss in getting back to you, I have do not have much time as I would like to check out these boards. I have been reminded in the past, by better / other half, that at times that I tend to reply / speak as if I was setting across the table drinking coffee and I could rectify what the person has said! So now, I agree that I do that, and that is when I started to color out side the lines. I am sorry about that Rick. I now understand your position, and have “ taken content in context”. Thanks

Sincerely
John




PS: perhaps I’ll see you at the Anvil Brand clinic in Lexington IL. I like to see one of those old Phoenix horse shoes you mention last year.

" I am not young enough to know everything" Oscar Wilde
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 08 Feb 2009 02:34 #21

Phil Armitage wrote:
Is the AAEP http://www.aaep.org/index.php relevant to the farrier community and horse owners?

I ask this because the first I learned of them was on this forum. Prior to that I have never heard of them. I have owned horses for over 25 years and have had several Vets. work on my horses, none of them mentioned the AAEP. None of my clients in all the years I have been shoeing ever mention the AAEP.

The AAEP's mission statement is very similar to the AFA's mission statement.

We are not a clandestine group but a umbrella organization under the AVMA. We have a listserve used for information exchange and an annual meeting used to present equine research and dicuss other topics such as slaugther and vaccination protocols. We also provide first response for situation for the media such as the case when Eight Belles which died on the track. Their are other groups under the avma that concentrate on different species. The members of the AAEP place special edification on equine practice but don't have to obtain additional certification to be a member.
I myself have use the same farrier for the last 15 years, we communicate well together seem to work through problems without discord. If a client has a farrier they are use to working with I don't have a problem with it as long as the client understands my diagnosis and my plan to resolve the problem, if the client and farrier disagree with me then they are free to seek another opinion.
In truth I have never asked Darrel, are any other farrier if they had certification but they have never question me about my qualification either.
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 08 Feb 2009 17:50 #22

  • Rick Burten
  • Rick Burten's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Enforcer
  • Posts: 9082
  • Thank you received: 50
  • Karma: 8
John Corkery wrote:
PS: perhaps I’ll see you at the Anvil Brand clinic in Lexington IL. I like to see one of those old Phoenix horse shoes you mention last year.

I'm planning on being there and if I can remember long enough, I'll bring you a Phoenix shoe.

When are you coming up?
Rick Burten PF

In the immortal words of Ron White: "But let me tell you something, folks: You can't fix S-tupid. There's not a pill you can take; there's not a class you can go to. S-tupid is forever."
."


Je pense donc je suis
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 08 Feb 2009 17:55 #23

  • calshoer
  • calshoer's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Guru
  • Posts: 7253
  • Karma: 0
The veterinarians I have worked over the years ( I was blessed to have some of these intelligent and talented people on my side) never expressed any interest in whether the farrier was and AFA member ,or certified in any organization. What they did want from the farrier was the skill to effectively apply a variety of lameness treatments.
In my career, none except one or two have been so demanding in their shoeing prescriptions that the farrier was only the "technician". Most have welcomed input from the farrier as to the practical aspects of treating an individual horse, because they knew that farrier had the knowledge and experience to help make those practical decisions.
This was true of the vets at the university who were usually open to suggestions from myself as well as the other staff farriers. You don't stay hired there very long unless you can "get 'er done" consistently. That means consistently sending horses home sounder than when they came in.
All but one of the private field veterinarians I have worked with in California and here in Colorado have been on the same page as a team, as well.
So I don't think the AFA has much meaning to most veterinarians. They want results, not letters after one's name.
Patty Stiller CNBF,CLS
www.hoofcareonline.com
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 08 Feb 2009 18:12 #24

  • calshoer
  • calshoer's Avatar
  • OFFLINE
  • Guru
  • Posts: 7253
  • Karma: 0
Thats unforunate, Rick.
I was different at UC Davis. Perhaps because when a farrier leaves there, his or her replacement is usually found through an application process which most strongly included recommendations from other farriers including the ones still on staff.And interviews. As a general rule there, the farrier staff quality was and has remained quite high.
Occasionally they got a part time farrier in who had greatly inflated their resume, (out and out lied in one case) but that got quickly remedied because the surgeons and attending veterinarians are not blind, and incompetence is therefore quickly revealed.
Patty Stiller CNBF,CLS
www.hoofcareonline.com
The administrator has disabled public write access.

RE:Is the AFA relevant to the VET COMMUNITY? 09 Feb 2009 18:45 #25

Martin Kenny wrote:
OK let's play nice here too, and keep on track; or I will shut it down.

Also Please note, I am adding one more aspect to the questions I have asked.

If you say, NO. please expound with a short note why you feel that way, do the same if you say YES.

Then if you say NO, please ad what you feel would make the AFA become relevant!

READ THE QUESTION AND ANSWER IT DIRECTLY< OR DON"T BOTHER ANSWERING IT AT ALL>

YES....and so should the Union for Vets treating racehorses.........Linda Marie

Yes ...and so should the Union for the racehorse owner/trainers........Linda Marie

Yes ...and so should the Union outside of racing be important; especially for the thoroughbred showhorse owners as these horses when done racing, have their own set of hoof/lameness problems that a journeymen plater can address.

thank you, Linda Marie
________
[URL="http://www.****tube.com/categories/43/voyeur/videos/1"]VOYEUR PORN[/URL]
The administrator has disabled public write access.
  • Page:
  • 1
  • 2

Kunena Birthday Module

  • frothies birthday is today
  • hatcher barry birthday is today
  • Felda5032 birthday is in 1 day
  • James L Duncan birthday is in 1 day
  • magicfingers birthday is in 1 day
  • Mike Chaffin birthday is in 364 days
Time to create page: 0.220 seconds

S5 Box

Register

*
*
*
*
*
*

Fields marked with an asterisk (*) are required.