help keeping eggbars on

[nancysleeman]

My gelding wears eggbars because of pedal osteitis and some suspensory issues. Has been sound for a year now. Has been losing shoe(s) regularly now that he is on pasture turn out. Have been told that this is because he is over reaching due to the mud. Tried bell boots as a local solution, but it didn't work. Any other suggestions for my farrier? Thanks.

[Phil Armitage]

Egg bars can come off real easy. All that extra material out the back of the foot can get stepped on or hang up in something very easly. The mud can cause a horse's front feet to get hung up and thier hind foot over reach and step on the shoe. It is not your Farrier's fault this is happening. The real solution is don't turn him out in the mud, if he he need Egg bars. Your the one that is going to have to keep his shoes on. Every time your horse steps on the shoes, he strains that leg and weakens the hoof. Why is he still in Egg bars, is this something the Vet wants?

[handandhammer]

What about srraight bars?

[calshoer]

What about srraight bars?

I doubt straight bars would not help the suspensory issues as much as an egg bar.

Breakover is one of the biggest issues with shoe pulling.
If the foot cannot easily roll over the toe, it will be delayed in heel lift off and the hind foot will likely catch it.
As well, a long toe will exaerbate (and can cause ) the pedal osteitis as the sole and dorsal hoof wall gets stretched forward away from the bone edge.
So be SURE the breakover point of the shoe is set back under that toe edge, in a spot relative to the tip of the cofin bone. Get XRays to help fimnd this if your farrier is not familiar wit hthe concept. And he must also know how to set that shoe there without causing sole pressure, and without removing any sole either. At the very least, seriously rocker the toe of the shoe and that may be all it takes to keep them on better.
Patty

[nancysleeman]

Thanks a ton! I will pass that info on to my farrier.

[nancysleeman]

Sorry, one more thing. What part does mud play in breakover? His eggbars seem to stay on a little long in the pasture when the weather is drier than when it is wet... THANKS SO MUCH

[Phil Armitage]

Sorry, one more thing. What part does mud play in breakover? His eggbars seem to stay on a little long in the pasture when the weather is drier than when it is wet... THANKS SO MUCH

Oh, great your off and running telling your farrier make sure the breakover is correct, this is why my horse is pulling his eggbars off in the mud, holly cow!!! :confused: The front feet stick in the mud, it would be like us walking in deep mud, same feeling but we do not have hind legs to worry about, then a hind foot comes forward and hits the front foot, quess what it lands right on the back of the eqgbar shoe pretty difficult to avoid a large piece of metal or aluminum that is there for a purpose like supporting your horses suspensorys. I quess I don't understand why you need to take chances and turn your horse out in the mud?????? Chances are your Farrier already knows about proper breakover if he is shoeing lame horses. Proper breakover, hoof balance and all that is pretty insignificant in mud. If he keeps them on when he is on dry footing and the eggbars help with his lameness then it sounds like your farrier is doing a pretty good job, be thankfull for that. Do your horse and farrier a favor and keep him out of the mud. If you have no choice then I quess you have to live with it, hopefull you won't loose a good farrier because your horse is becomeing high maintenance and takeing up your farriers family time.

[Gary Hill]

Like Phil said keep this horse out of the mud. I always square the toes of the hind shoes when I need to apply eggbars in front. It helps them from grabbing the heels of the eggbars. Good Luck! Gary

[calshoer]

Phil is right about the mud , but the farrier may be froutrated too, if the shoes keep coming off.
And breakover IS one common factor in shoe pulling.
Heck I don't know if the current farrier is or isn't rockering the toes already , but he may not be, and it CAN'T DO ANY HARM to try, if he isn't . :mad:
It is sound advice.
I know LOTS of farriers who shoe lots of lame horses but still do not address breakover enough ,so that is why I suggest it.
If he already is, GREAT. If not it won't hurt to try it and maybe the shoes will stay on better , and the FARRIER will be happier.
Patty

[nancysleeman]

Patty - Thank you for your kind words. I live in a muddy area and if I kept my horse out of the mud, as some other people meantioned, he would be in his stall all the time. So it is not my ******ity that has him outside in the mud. I appreciate your assumption that I was asking a valid question and that I have to deal with mud and that my farrier has to deal with mud. My farrier is not argery or frustrated. He feels challenged and I was hoping to come up with some suggestions to offer him. I thought I might get some wonderful ideas from the professionals on this site. This was my very first post. So, Patty, your reply was appreciated. Thank you.

[Phil Armitage]

I do not know for sure what your paddock looks like, how muddy or what size, however I am starting to get the picture it is not good enough for a horse. Here is food for thought, I wonder how much the muddy paddock has caused lack of excercise and stress on the suspensorys? He might as well be in a stall. I am not suggesting that your ******, just trying to get you to take a harder look at your horse. I am from the old school that if you do not have the proper facility for a horse to live in, then do not have a horse. Sounds harsh, but it is good advice. Horses are not like ATV, motocycles, boats etc... Board the horse at a barn with better turn out so they can get proper excercise. Excercise is very important in maintaining a healthy horse, they need to run around, play roll. It does not have to be a very large turn out, but at least dry, if it is not dry then they will not run and play in fear of falling. One of the barns I work at took in horse that was in a muddy paddock, the horse move poorly in the hind end, because of lack of excercise, the barn is hand walking him and lungeing daily and he gets daily turn out, there has been improvement just from excercise, we first thought the horse was lame, he still needs more time to make sure there are no other issues, but the poor horse must be aching all over from lack of excercise.

[Rick Burten]

Once the farrier completes his/her task, s/he is no longer incharge of the horse's destiny.

When a farrier is asked to put on a very specialized orthotic, and egg bars are just that, it then becomes en***bent upon the owner to provide an environment that is most conducive to that horse keeping the orthotics in place.

Now, a little, superficial, mud is probably not going to be of much consequence especially if the turn out area is flat and debris free. If the area is a large one and the horse likes to rip around and get himself all doubled up, then there is probably no way an egg bar shoe is going to remain attached to the horse's hoof.

If the turn out area has deep mud and/or environmental debris, then no amount of rockering the toe of the front shoes or blunting/setting back the toe of the hind shoes is going to prevent a horse from pulling off that egg bar.

Since the horse is now apparently recovered from both the pedal osteitis and the suspensory issue, why is he still in the egg bars? If he is still wearing the eggbars because of a veterinary requirement, then you have to change his environment.

One thing your farrier might try is to "safe" the foot surface edge of the back of the bar. This means that the edge is beveled so that if it is struck by a hind foot the hind foot tends to slide off the edge rather than grabbing and pulling the shoe.

Your farrier might also consider adding low side clips to the front shoes
and if shod behind, in addition to a set back toe, short heel extensions.

Does the horse wear pads in front and/or what type of additional support is given to the frog, bars, commissures and sole, posterior to the apex of the frog?

Can you post some pictures?

Rick

[Ronald Aalders]

[QUOTE=Rick Can you post some pictures?

Rick[/QUOTE]


As so often before, Rick is on the spot here again, be it a little late :p


Ronald Aalders

[Rick Burten]

[QUOTE=Rick Can you post some pictures?

Rick


As so often before, Rick is on the spot here again, be it a little late :p


Ronald Aalders[/QUOTE]


Hey Ron

Do you know how hard it is to keep up with all the houskeeping chores while Baron is away? :eek: :eek

Besides, my 'most-timers' is acting up and I just forgot to reply. But dang, its just been a couple of days since the original post. Can't you give an old man a break(metaphorically speaking, of course) once in a while?

Now, where did I put that Ginko Bilboa? :confused: :confused:

Rick

[nancysleeman]

Thanks you guys. My fath in this site is restored! I am just a newbie and needed a little advice. As to your questions and advice - I totally trust my farrier, I just wanted to give him some ideas as I know he has been working hard to come up with solutions to help my boy. My farrier is a pretty outstanding guy - talented, too. So, will get back to you with more information if required... including pictures.

What a great resource you folks have going here for each other and for owners.

Thanks.

Nancy