Your Opinions Please

[krdennis]

I have been offered an 18 year-old former show ring hunter. He would be very suitable for me as I am an older rider and he is very quiet. The problem that has surfaced is navicular syndrome.

The horse showed "sudden" lameness in the RF that became very acute and then leveled off. The first vet thought it was an abcess; the second vet thought it was a stone bruise. It did not go away. The owner had the horse x-rayed and ultrasounded. The x-rays did not show any significant changes. The vet injected the coffin joint (bone?). Owner's farrier puts one eggbar shoe on the front and regular shoes on the other three feet.

The horse came to me to try and was still lame. My farrier (who I worship) put a 1 degree pad and eggbars on both front feet and lightened up the shoes in the rear. My vet appointment was yesterday (at owner's expense). I had a CD of the ultrasound that my vet showed "distension?" of the navicular bursa and enlargement on one side of the DDFT. The horse was sensitive across heels to the hoof testers and bulbed heels.
He injected both front navicular bursas. In the worst foot (RF) he said there was "strong effusion."

Now it is a wait and see game. My question is "what percentage of horses improve with this?" They also mentioned trying blocking with ethanol.

[krdennis]

Come on guys, talk to me!

[horseshoer123]

Everyone's at a big farrier conference, give it acouple of days. Phyllis

[krdennis]

Okay, Thanks so much.

[crazy k horseshoeing]

i am not simple leave it alone will be trouble for the rest of its lifejust walk away high mantance no fun

[krdennis]

That certainly looks like it's heading that way. I really wish this horse could be fixed.

[Thomas_Ride&Drive]

Walk away.....

The horse is lame - so you can't ride it at all

Its a good age and will require a lot of farriery and veterinary work which will take time and expense and prognosis with navicular must always be guarded.

There's too many good horses out there - so you don't need a problem one.

[cowgirlup]

walk away is good advice! do it now before you get emotionally attatched.

[calshoer]

Xrays showing internal hoof balance(bone alignment) would be most helpful to assist with this. I find that when a horse has"clean" xrays buit is still needing some kind of joint or navicular bursa injections, or showing
enlarged" bursa, that there is nearly always internal bone alignment (hoof balance) issues that the farrier is missing. (or creating) .
Sometimes (depends on the pathology) these horses can be made quite sound with corrrect hoof balancing and shoeing.
I have even had clients with obviously crippled rescue horses who had bone spurs on the navicular bones made quite comfortable and useably sound with the right kind of shoeing .
But it takes a vet and farrier who both understand the internal hoof balance isues that cause the stresses,and know how to remedy them. If a veterinarian does not assess coffin joint alignment, breakover point, or medial lateral baance ,their lameness assessment , I usualy find that they do not understand the importance of those things. (fortunately I have worked with many vets who do).

Patty

[krdennis]

Thank all of you so much. I will try to get copies of those x-rays and post them some how.

This is such a heartbreak. As I said, I am an older (55 yrs old) "rerider" returning to riding after a very long break. I was looking for an older, quiet horse for WTC, riding in my hunt seat lesson and trail riding. I am, however, a school teacher so do not have unlimited funds to spend on a horse I cannot ride.

I can return the horse and walk away.

[crazy k horseshoeing]

get it done then your find a pony some where loads out there

[goeslikestink]

walk away it will cost you more than you can afford in the long run if like you say you have limited funds--

so often people say i ahve limited funds so looking for this or that andget offered
or look for horses that are cheap---
unless you hve the back ground of knowing that some cheap horses can be re-hab ie abuse or mostly type are ones that are underweight etc
but its till takes knowledge of the horse to determine if its worthwhile or not--

to the the horse owner thats new - or like yourself re newing a past hobby
then you are still a novice --

and to which if limited funds then you dont wont to be seen as a mug
to be off loaded on other peoples equines that have faults and issues that are long term--- and costly

for--- instances -- if you brought the horse how long before you could ride it if you could ride it -
2nd what ever it was before as in used to be -- isnt that now

3rd the overall cost-- like i said limited funds quoated by self
in the long run vets bills and finding out what it is to what it isnt cost more than intial outlay----
thinking of the horse tack and baording

so
-- go find a horse thats equal to your expenses your overall costs to keep it and matian its welfare -- in good husbandry and one that you can ride as in as soon as its settled into the new home that you have provided for the horse--
limited fundings means intial cost and overall costs of ones pays packet
and not just for out for the horse itself and tack

if it works out it cost to much then surgest a riding school that can offer
you either lessons or pony days whereby your can hire the horse for the day and yet treat it as your own but bieing under the guidance of the trainer and hopefully a qualifed one

or perhaps take somes whos knowledgable to give an unbias opnion
to the animals which you are looking at there splenty of resuce centers
that have alisted donation for said animals --whereby you have quartly or yearly checks as an adoptive home
which is an option to low on the funds front --
but be aware that these horses might have issues to but should have a vetinary record of what type of issues if they have any to go along with the horse before its released

you can also look as to tpye of horse required under breed associations
some have links to adpotive places of that type

[SharaNihan]

Walk away.

Then consider on-farm leasing, either part or full. More stables in my area are offering this, which makes me happy. For the beginning, or rebeginning rider, owning a horse is overrated. I wouldn't recommend leasing off-farm.

Sound schoolmasters are available if you wait. In general they aren't advertised, but are exchanged by word of mouth. I used to ride a dressage GP schoolmaster who after he was "retired" was still shown, and ended up being shortlisted to the USET at 16 years of age. Pretty good for a free horse.

[Tom Stovall, CJF]

krdennis in gray, deletia

I have been offered an 18 year-old former show ring hunter. He would be very suitable for me as I am an older rider and he is very quiet. The problem that has surfaced is navicular syndrome.

The horse showed "sudden" lameness in the RF that became very acute and then leveled off. The first vet thought it was an abcess; the second vet thought it was a stone bruise. It did not go away. The owner had the horse x-rayed and ultrasounded. The x-rays did not show any significant changes. The vet injected the coffin joint (bone?). Owner's farrier puts one eggbar shoe on the front and regular shoes on the other three feet.

The horse came to me to try and was still lame. My farrier (who I worship) put a 1 degree pad and eggbars on both front feet and lightened up the shoes in the rear. My vet appointment was yesterday (at owner's expense). I had a CD of the ultrasound that my vet showed "distension?" of the navicular bursa and enlargement on one side of the DDFT. The horse was sensitive across heels to the hoof testers and bulbed heels.
He injected both front navicular bursas. In the worst foot (RF) he said there was "strong effusion."

Now it is a wait and see game. My question is "what percentage of horses improve with this?"

On the basis of what you've written, it'd be extremely difficult to offer any sort of reply that you'll find helpful.

What is the physical appearance of the horse's front feet?

Is the horse lame in both fronts?

Did the vet block (inject with anesthetic) the coffin joint before blocking the posterior digital nerves?

How did the horse move after the "bad" foot was blocked?

How long between shoeing and manifestation of symptoms?

Radiographs, while extremely useful, are not definitive in the diagnosis of problems associated with the navicular area unless a fracture or new bone growth is involved. In the usual order of business, a nerve block is considered definitive relative to the location of a pathology, the rear third of the hoof has a helluva lot of room for things to go wrong, and not all of 'em are associated with the navicular bone. :)

I ask this stuff because you didn't specifically mention any of these things and they're fairly important. You did mention "sudden" onset which sounds kinda suspicious because, other than fractures, chip movement, abscesses, punctures, etc., horses seldom go from sound to dead lame overnight from any cause not readily evident by visual inspection or palpation.

They also mentioned trying blocking with ethanol.

An alcohol block is designed to interrupt nervous impulses between the pain and the brain: Wouldn't it be a better idea to find out for sure what's wrong before doing something that will hide the cause?

[Thomas_Ride&Drive]

the OP posted in February. I presumed by now a decision had been made but we'd not had any feedback or an update.