Reality?

[Mike Ferrara]

I had trouble deciding whether to put this post here or in the career improvement forum but here it is.

Since I started participating in horse shoeing discussion on the internet (I didn't have internet when I was doing customer horses before) I've read so much about what's wrong with traditional farriery and how some of these "new" methods address it.

Needless to say I've started to look at many of these horses and be able to imagine what would be said about them here if pictures where posted.

One of the things that I did this past week was to trim a bunch of brood mares at a local breeding farm. I've done these horses a couple of other times but the last time was about 5 months ago (maybe a little more) and in this bunch of mares you can see just about every hoof deformity on the face of the planet. These horses range in age from 5 to 20+ and stand in a stall with short periods of turn out in small padocks that are mostly flooded right now...at least that's where I've seen them.

The second time I did them was not so long after the first and things were looking better. Now? Forget it. My wife has been wanting to learn more so we briefely discussed each one as I did them. Of course I call the clients attention to everything that I can get their attention on.

I asked my wife if she thought the problems were due to traditional farriery. Yes I was leading here. I asked her if she thought that I could fix them. She said that she thought I could but I corrected her pointing out that there wasn't a chance in hell. She asked why argueing that she thought that I knew how to address each one. I of course agreed that I at least thought I knew where I would start but went on to point out that I hadn't been hired to do that and further pointed out the obvious lack of interest by the client.

So...how much of the problem is farrier technique vs general practices used in the horse business in general? I know in this and countless other cases, I don't buy that I caused the problems and I'm not being asked to address them beyond what I can do with a trim at irregular, unpredictable and mostly extremely long intervals. I certainly don't think these feet say anything about my knowledge or skill as a farrier. If they were put on a regular schedule and a little money was spent I think I could help them. By all means "4 point" or "NB" that if you think you can. LOL

I suppose a farrier could charge them through the roof or just refuse the work but would that help me build a business in a new area? What would that cliet pass on about me in the way of "word of mouth advertising"? I guess if it was a unique situation I'd walk but it's not all that out of the norm is it? Maybe a little more extreme with some brood mares but the same attitudes or ignorance seem pretty wide spread.

Well, there's my conversation starter and rant for the morning.

[calshoer]

Good morning and thanks for a very good question.
Heres my thoughts and expriences. .
I feel that of course a lot of the problems in domesticated horses hooves is due to the the husbandry, the limited envronment ,the unatural feeding, poor breeding ,poor riding etc. It is a man made problem.
What discovered over the years is that I was able to help these horses to some extent some by utilizing the practices and principles I was first taught. Of course regular trimmig of ANY sort is going to help those mares feet a lot. And a good traditional trim is really not much different from a trim based more on the natural wear patterns.. Bare feet are not so much of a problem as long as they are maintained on a regular basis, no matter what the technique.
Shoeing is completely anoher matter however. What I discovered is that with thew early tachniques I used, I was able to keep SOME of them looking fairly good with the techniques I was taught back in the ealy 80's. And most of them seemingly sound, but with too many I still struggled with puny frogs, sore heels, corns, advancing navicular syndrome, stumbling, shoe pulling, continually flaring here and there, a few quarter cracks, etc.
When I changed my tactics to using shoeing principles based on how a foot would maintain all on it's own in a wild environment, the problems virtually all went away. The feet mainained in a much,much more healthy state despite the unnatural husbandry, the limited environment, the bad breeding etc. In other words, I felt I was offering the foot what it needed even though I was shoeing it and the horse was kept in a completely unnatural environment.
Patty .

[Gary Hill]

When I take on a new account I try to make it clear to the new clients that if they want to use my services that they must maintain a regular spot in my book. If I see something that I feel is out of wack or a major problem I want to talk to them right then and there to find out just what their expectations are. Most clients don't have a clue if theres a problem and others are EXPERTS that have run off every other farrier they've used because they were unable to fix what ever was wrong. Getting these out in the open at the very beginning give you the option as to whether you want to keep them as clients or hand them a card with some other poor souls number on it! If you decide to keep them ,then I feel it's my responsibility to make sure I do the best job for that horse and work with the problems by keeping to a regular schedule for any amount of time needed from 4 weeks to 8, the particular horse will dictate that. I have some stops with multible horses and they all eat the same and have the same living conditions but one will grow a half inch in 7 weeks while his stablemate barely grows anything? Being that they are in my book, I make the adjustments. Those folks that only want a farrier twice ayear rarely get an appointment from me and if they do they pay big for it! And thats only because of the extreme extra work bringing them back knowing I won't see them again for another 6 months. Broodmare's with bad feet can be nightmares (no pun intented) but as long as they stay sound enough to carry a foal every year the owners are happy. I know some guys that go though a broodmare band and only use their nippers to trim and don't even use a rasp. I guess if that works for all involved so be it? I think most farriers take PRIDE in their work and want to do the best for the animal involved but as we all know that isn't always the case! Thanks and Good Luck! Gary

[Mike Ferrara]

Thanks Patty,

I, of course didn't mean to suggest that new things haven't been learned over the years or even that I haven't changed the way I do things myself over time. My main point is really the lack of control that you have sometimes.

I will say that some of the problems that some have attributed to "traditional farriery" aren't typical of what I would call traditional farriery. Bad farriery maybe but not necessarily traditional.

And a good traditional trim is really not much different from a trim based more on the natural wear patterns..

I would agree.


What I discovered is that with thew early tachniques I used, I was able to keep SOME of them looking fairly good with the techniques I was taught back in the ealy 80's. And most of them seemingly sound, but with too many I still struggled with puny frogs, sore heels, corns, advancing navicular syndrome, stumbling, shoe pulling, continually flaring here and there, a few quarter cracks, etc.

I saw my share of quarter cracks and puny frogs on long footed saddlebreds. Both could be battled and corrected usually. Even there, though, the demands of the client were often a key issue. I haven't seen very many true qurter cracks on short footed horses and when I have it's usually been along with some other injury or complicating factor.

Some of the other problems you mention..shoe pulling, flaring and stumbling for example just wouldn't have been tolorated. Sore anything didn't go over too good. I've worked on some navicular horses but in most cases they were that way when I got them and often up there in age. I will say this...and I say it with no claim of being any kind of expert on the EDSS sytem (Ihaven't even seen the video)...but we were applying home built packages that were mechanically simalar way back when I first started around 1980. When I say mechanically similar I mean addressing breakover, using pads with inserts to provide frog support. We had to do some improvising when it came to materials but, from the cursory look I've taken at the EDSS system, I'd say that many of the ideas were along the same lines. What we did sure seemed to work and I would expect that correctly applied that some of todays more formalized systems also work well. Also when I say "we" I mean to say that it's things I was taught and not things that I claim to have invented. I don't even know if the guy who taught me invented it...maybe some of it.

[Mike Ferrara]

Some good points Gary,

Unfortunately, at present, I'm not in a great position to place many conditions on my customers. If I can charge enough for the work I do, there isn't anything irresponsible about the set up with regard to safety or the laws of God and man as I understand them, I'm on it. I'd feel better about my own work if the horses were managed such that progress can be made but the ultimate responsibility for the horses lies with the owner...who is the decission maker and the one paying the bills. I advise and do what I'm asked to do and am compensated for. I think I will charge more though but only because the horses are more work and the feet aren't a great testimony for me (some possible risk?)...though I imagine few see them. Certainly as I get busier there will hopefully come a time when I just can't fit such irregular drop-ins into my schedule but starting in a new area, I don't have that problem yet.

I do think though that situations like this are where at least some of the critisizm of "traditional farriery" come from. This is of course just the latest case and I couldn't even begin to count the examples I've seen over the years.