Some thoughts(not my own) worth considering

[Rick Burten]

Dr. James Rooney, DVM, posted these thoughts on another thread. I think they are relevant and worth reviewing and considering.

"First of all, raising heel and shortening toe is done on the foot with a long toe, low heel and a hoof angle much less than 50 degrees, in other words, AN ABNORMAL FOOT". (Caps are my addition and are for emphasis only)

"Second, no one is claiming "cure" only amelioration of an IMPROPER CONDITION" . (again, caps are mine)

"Finally I refuse to get involved in the Strasser situation-ONE OF THE MAIN SOURCES OF THE UNSUBSTANTIATED CLAIMS ABOUT BLOOD FLOW" . (Again caps are mine)

"Measuring such flow accurately and over a period of time and interpreting the results properly is a difficult task and not for casual diddling around. I am not an expert in peripheral vascular physiology and neither are any of those who are making claims about foot and hoof vascular flow. Just shooting in a dye and taking pictures or slapping on a Doppler ultrasound does not mean the results are being correctly interpreted."

and finally,

There is so much myth and nonsense spouted to support crackpot theorizing about the foot of the horse, it is only a miracle that man has not succeeded in destroying the animal utterly". (bold emphasis is mine)

Rick

[Ronald Aalders]

Hi Rick,


Dr. Rooney may well be right, but on the other hand we can hardly all sit and wait until things are proven beyond any doubt. Until then we all just have to take that leap in the dark every once in a while. Let's face it that's what horse shoeing has been about for a thousand years if not longer.

I still think this is one of the reasons why especially shoers need to stay informed on other views of horses and horse shoeing as well. If only to learn how not to do it. The easiest way to do this is through these forums. Nowadays they even allow you to post pictures, jump from website to website and get acces to a vast quantity of information that was not so long ago unheard of.

Again I feel it's very imporant to not exclude views from boards like these. That would lead us to a situation where we'ld all agree very much on everthing. That would not help us much I guess.

I see it as a responsibility we have toward the horse that just has to pick up a foot and can not do anything more then hope for the best. I too have a hard time dealing with people that claim they have the solution for certain problems and stop listening to others. But we should be wiser than that. We owe this to the horse and our profession.



Ronald Aalders

[Jason Maki]

Ron,
A few years ago the political left was complaining aBOUT Rush Limbaugh, that they needed "equal time" on the radio to counter his logical, and clear thinking arguments. His response was "I am equal time!" . Again, he was right considering CBS, NBC,ABC,CNN, MSNBC, The Assoc.Press, The New York TImes, The Washington Post et all are about as left of center as Karl Marx. The left's( true beleivers with a Plan) ideas are ussually not founded on solid principle, but founded on the erronous belief that people cannot take care of themselves and need an all knowing Government to take care of things for them. Anyone who beleives themselves and their beleifs to be omnipotent and infallible does not like the light of truth to shine through the whole cloth their dreams are woven from:they cry foul! "Sound philosophy creates sound doctrine" is a phrase i learned at a conservative symposium at Georgetown Law( There is an oxy-***** "Georgetown", '" and "conservative"--one of these things is not like the others!) When a philosophy is found to be inheriently flawed, the proponents of the philosophy often times feel personaly assualted. That is the nature of things.
I personally feel that Dr. Tesky has some interesting ideas that are worth exploring, if for no other reason than to disprove. I think the shrill tone of his wrong headed beleif that shoes and ipso facto farriers are harmful to horses is the justifiable reason for the tough but fair handling his thinking received. He walked into a pit bulls cage with a steak around his neck. I also returned his e-mail with the note that I personally think his posts had a degree of merit, and if the decision for ostricision was mine( this is not my ball, my bat or my feild, and the powers that be can and will make their judgements based upon their own rules, for their own good reasons. Fair is fair and needs to be respected and excepted! :cool: ) I would keep him just to have a polar veiw to argueagainst! I do feel his overarching philosophy and agenda are wrong , despite having points based in reality.
This wonderful forum is a benign dicatorship, which Plato stated is the best kind of regieme( and almost impossible to achieve), so we must respect the decision reached. I would add this Machiavellian thought: Would it not be best to have your "enemy" stating his case where you can hear and see everything he does; as to be able to counter quickly and succinctly to stop the spread of his influence? :D
Far to loquacious and philosophical this evening,
Jason

[Donnie Walker]

Good points by all. I don't know any of those responding but I can say that the beliefs of each have merit, being based possibly on research, and/or experience in trial and error in research or practical procedures. Each respondent is equally firm in those beliefs, similar to the recent presidential election, that showed us being a divided nation (51% to 49%). I am in agreement with Ronald. We must evaluate all the information available to us, and remember, that with "good" there is some "bad", and with "bad" there is some "good", depending solely upon one's positive or negative feelings of the subject. In the end, however, we all share a common goal, and must not cloud our thoughts in our quest for knowledge.

[handandhammer]

Adolf Hitler donated lots of money to help German orphanages.........The road to hell is paved with good intentions

[Rick Burten]

I don't think Baron is going to ban the good doctor. that is not his way. I have never said that I think Tesky should be banned from this site. Quite the opposite, a position that has be well stated by several other members.

What is unfortunate is that when placed on the receiving end of negative commentary, he chose to "run to mommy to protect him".

I did, at last, get the vaunted e-mail directly from the doctor. I can't begin to tell you how relieved I am to know that I have not been overlooked, forgotten, or ostrasized by him.

It is important to note that in said e-mail, we find both the whining, complaining, "Life's Unfair to me" mommy help me plea and the "since I can't get my way I'm taking my toys and leaving" attitude.

Remember, Baron has never once said that Tesky had to go, it is Tesky himself who said he is leaving.

Through the years there have been many contentious discussions, finger pointing and rhetoric on this site. Most of the participants are still with us and still contribute. This is a good thing. Sometimes we agree to disagree without being disagreeable. Other times, not. So what? I for one appreciate the diverse personalities displayed here(especially since several of them are mine! :D )

Rick
"Cry havoc, let slip the dogs of war...."

and,among others,

Two Dogs, Warrior Prince of the FIN
"where the fugrwe?" "No ****! I thought thats where we were going, not where we've already been."

[Phil Armitage]

:D :D :D I like the smiles, the big grin is what I have on my face right now. I recieved a special hello from Dr. Tesky, I do recall that I said some harsh things, but I have also said some positive things. I also remember being persoanly critisised by Dr. Tesky. I did not complain to Baron or anyone else, I just took it for what it was worth and moved on. Dr. Tesky believes that us Farriers are harming horses the minute we apply a steel shoe. And he clearly states that we should be ashamed of it. I am truely suprised that an individual with Dr. Tesky's experience and knowledge could believe this. I am not suprised that he has follower who will believe anything he says. This will surely come around and bite him in the butt one day and probably cost him consideralby. I would be concerned if I were him, you can only sell snake oil for so long before the town folks form a lynch mob.

[Red Amor]

G,day Gents
recicved my general notice from the good Doc on the week end

I dont know what it is with these types of folk
they start out sing help the horse , its the horse the horse the horse but Its mostly about the quick easy buck Im thinking there on about

and its done with controvisy buy sensaionalising ,publically bagging traditional Farriery , stiring up **** and therefore being more notices and wheather right or wrong people will click to somethings new particularly if its to save them money

then its Oh buy this get that do this come here we have it all easerly available to you at the $300.oo odd clinic

ITS A FRANCHISE , BIUSNESS , and its a licence to print money , with out doing the hard yards of LEARNING TO PROPERLY SHOE THE HORSE and all the very hard work that goes with it and taking NO RESPONSIBLITY FOR THEIR ACTIONS
JUST SIGN HERE

Ive noticed the the farriers or farriery minded people ive helped have mostly given something back to either me or someone ealse, and good O to that

The bare footers on the other hand have taken greederly and run off bagging farriery , Me , my friends out
some come back hat in hand good O to that
some wont get a chance to , theyve been too unkind , I dont carrie grudges , I just wont waist time I like most will dedicate my time to where its appreciated

I do admire the tanasity of some of these people , and their knowlage several people down this way impressed me with this and there abilitty to publically spruke it

sooner or later people will see that for the most part it isnt the holy grail they were looking for and return to their old mate the farrier
there is and will be others that will be happy with what theyve found and for them I couldnt be happier TRUELY

Its not Farriery or Barefooting that stuffs up horses hooves , its bad Bad farriery and barefooting trimming that does so

do we need registration and quallification?
As an unquallifide full time Farrier working hard to become such I have to say YES
For both Farriery and Barefooters , something has to be done to stem the tied
of oppertunistic half hearted jokers that slip in for a quick feed {sea gulls] I call em , they slip in prance about , speek and look flash squarkin badmouthed about anything that anyone will lissen to while they chase off who and what ever and swipe their , chips =frys
I love seeing them choake on a hot chip and when theyve bitten off more that they can chew , gready smart bastards some of them are

One thing Ive learnt in this tuff game is humility , and this gift had given me somewhere to go when I am stumped and need help to be able to help or fix up my stuff up

I work on around 2500 horses a year and everyone of them is trimmed every single one , about a third of these are shod maybe more
Ive been learning Farriery for about only 11 years many of these gulls just a few

It hurts my feelings when someone ofen much younger than I and I dont have a problem with the age thing truley , tells me Farriers are all dick heads and we are cruel fools destroing horses hooves
theyve been learning and trimming two or three years but havent bothered to learn the hole story , Havent had to , theyve just taken the easy way and paying for their working holliday here and there
Ive not been on an over seas holliday ever , Have I got it wrong fellars ?

I love what I do for a living , Im proud of the effort Ive put in and am still putting in to try to make the good fellers who gave me my start just as proud that they did
Im very greatfull for thes boards and the forums , and to you blokes and the Baron for starting all this in the first place
and Im bloody anoide and the likes of the Doc and others that slag him you us me for who and what we are and what we do
but scream blue murder it we disagree with them

I just whis I was as atriculet in expressing myself as many of you are ,

I learnt the hard way dont chuck rocks and try not to burn bridges
rocks hurt when there thrown back and Im a poor swimmer