from one hoof to the other

[farrierswife]

my hubby has been working on a arab gelding that the wld is shifting from hoof to hoof. The horse has been to see 3 different vets, all of whom seems stumped. As soon as we get one hoof healed up, it comes back in the other hoof. They are now using the white lightning, it was recommended to us by another shoer so we ordered some for her. Does this heat up as it is working? I talked to the owner today and she said that he had some heat in his hoof. The stalls are cleaned, this is the only horse in a barn of 45 that has it?????? He is in his stall nearly all day and night (show barn) when he gets out of his stall he is/was worked in a indoor. Hardly ever does he get outside. Any one have any ideas?

[George Geist]

Farriers Wife,
Based on the limited amount of information given I have a few questions. Does your horse have rubber mats in his stall? Do you have a constantly wet wash stall that you use frequently? Are the other horses in the barn also afflicted with this?

White lightning causes a chemical reaction when mixed and applied which should give off a little heat. As I understand it the gas released by it is what does all the work.

WLD is an anaerobic bacteria similar to thrush. It can be found in the ground or almost anywhere. The problem is minimized in parts of the country that get a few weeks of a good hard freeze in the winter. This seems to kill it.

What you are describing sounds like an environment exists that is friendly toward this organism. I might try disinfecting the wash stall, if you use mats get rid of them. Bed him on dirt preferably on straw bedding. Finally and I think most importantly lime the stall. I've never seen WLD in a place where the stalls were limed at least once a week.

As for treating the feet I've had some pretty good luck with Save a Hoof gel.
George

[farrierswife]

I'm sorry maybe I confused you, but I never said anything about a wash stall. The barn don't have a wash stall. His stall has no mats in it, and it has been stripped down and limed I think they only limed it once, they (the owner and another person at the barn) are going to strip the stall out again the wash the stall with bleach, let it air dry and then put the bedding back in. (shavings) How is straw better then shavings?
No, no other horse in the barn has it, there is about 45 horses on the place in 2 different barns. He is in the main barn.
The horse is kept clean with his feet picked out, his stall is cleaned.
Maybe they will have to up the stripping of the stall and keep it limed very well every week.

[Phil Armitage]

my hubby has been working on a arab gelding that the wld is shifting from hoof to hoof. The horse has been to see 3 different vets, all of whom seems stumped. As soon as we get one hoof healed up, it comes back in the other hoof. They are now using the white lightning, it was recommended to us by another shoer so we ordered some for her. Does this heat up as it is working? I talked to the owner today and she said that he had some heat in his hoof. The stalls are cleaned, this is the only horse in a barn of 45 that has it?????? He is in his stall nearly all day and night (show barn) when he gets out of his stall he is/was worked in a indoor. Hardly ever does he get outside. Any one have any ideas?

The white lightning does not heat up while it works. How are you useing it? The recommened method is to mix it 50/50 with white vineger. The reaction with Vinegar makes a gas that penetrates the hoof and gets up into the foot very deep to kill fungus. It does not harm live tissue. The ideal method is to make your mixture and put into a use IV bag (they are strong) tape the end around the leg and let the foot soak for aprox. 15-20 minutes. Another method is to soak cotton or gauze in the solution and tape it onto the bottom of the feet for about the same amount of time. This should be done barefoot if you can, steel and aluminum react with the mixture.

I have very good success with white lightning and I really like how effective it is and it does not harm live tissue. I find just a small amount is needed when mixing it up for use, because the gas is what does the work. Probably a 1/4 cup of each for each foot is plenty.

[farrierswife]

Ok, it was mixed 50/50 with the white vinger, then it was applied to the hoof. it was not soaked for that long. I only know that I spoke with the horse owner and she said that the hoof felt hot, we have not been back to the barn.

[Phil Armitage]

Might be warm from infection or laminitis.

[George Geist]

Farriers Wife,
Since I seem to be best known around here for fanning the flames of controversy, here I go again.

Straw is a better bedding for the following reasons:
First of all if you were the one sleeping in the stall what would you rather lay in? Yes its more comfortable. For this reason mattresses used to be made from it years ago.

Shavings contain pine sap and turpentine. This slows hoof growth and makes them hard as rock. Horses bedded on straw have better and healthier hoof growth with healthier texture free of false soles and so forth.

The hyper absorbensy of shavings also takes the natural oils out of horses coats when they lay in it. For this reason those on straw always have shinier, healthier, nicer coats.

The 2 main reasons people use shavings are cost and smell. Cost is a personal issue but as to the pine smell everyone likes, yes, it smells better.

I find that not to be advantageous either. Reason being is that when using straw your stall will stink when dirty. This is good as it forces you to keep the stalls clean.

There is a new bedding growing in popularity now that looks like cat litter. This stuff will suck the rain out of the sky. I find it to be even worse than shavings for all the same reasons.

Occasionally youll come across a horse who eats his bedding. With straw it wont hurt him.

I tell people these things out in the world and it doesnt really matter. They like shavings better. Most people dont like straw I know I'm in a small minority with that. What you can do to counter the effects of the turpentine is to paint your horses soles with iodine about 3 times a week.

On the issue of WLD it is my belief that this has been around a lot longer than most of us think. I can remember doing horses in the early'80s that had all the symptoms. I remember their walls getting so hollowed out that I could push a nail all the way in by hand. Back then we just thought it was chronically "bad feet".

Why do some horses get it and others dont? I dont know. Why did cases of it skyrocket in the 1990s in the wake of Hurricane Andrew? Again I dont know.

If I were to hypothesize and point a finger I might be inclined to blame contaminated vaccines for this too. (See wormers and vaccines thread for more on that).

Ok gauntlets been thrown. All you shavings devotees fire away.
George

[farrierswife]

I personally find your points of view interesting. I'm not here to get into a conversary over anything. However I am here in the best interest of a horse and his owner. Turning this barn of over 40 horses to use straw will never happen, however I can pass on your views to the animals owner, I don't think the barn owner will go along with it.(that's a whole different subject)
This case has been a thorn in everyone's side. As I said before 3 different vet's, the barn owner who has alot of knowledge, my husband who has worked on cases of WLD and had it cleared up in no time. This has been going on for over a year. It jumps from one hoof to the other as soon as we have one hoof grown just about out, BAM comes up lame again with WLD in the other hoof. No other horse in the barn has it....... Just don't make any sense....

[J.H. shoeing]

sometimes nothing makes sense, it just is.

Keep treating the WLD on a case by case basis. I would like to know why this particular horse has it jump from foot to foot after it has been cleared up. May try moving the horse to a different barn.

What is the history on this horse has it always had issues with WLD or did it just appear after coming into this barn?

[Phil Armitage]

Maybe it reappears because it was not totaly removed. :eek:

[farrierswife]

well that's the thing, the horse came up with it geez I guess it's really been about a year and half after going to a show. He was not the only horse from the barn that went to the show a bunch of them went I'd say 8-10 went, he is the only one who came home and shortly after that show came down with the WLD. The horse was taken to vet hospital where x-rays were done, ect ect. and the vet cut the hoof wall away said to treat it with idionie (sp) it was cleaned out I would "assume" (we were not at the barn the whole time) Looked to be cleared up, per the vet instruction rebuilt the hoof with epoxy. She started to work him again every was fine, then about 6-8 months later, Bam came up lame again, we could find nothing didn't respond to the hoof testers. x-rays done again, WLD in the other hoof, same course of treatment, 6 months or so has gone by, the hoof is almost grown out, now we back in the orginal hoof again. The horse's owner has just bought a house with a barn ect ect. but it needed some work before she wanted to move the horse there. I personally would of moved him already! Maybe being in the stall, for the most part (don't get out to run) do you think could have something to do with it. No natural light and air?????????