Flat feet, navicular and shoes.

[*Heidiers*]

Within the next few weeks I will be purchasing a 16 year old quarterhorse gelding. He was purchased when he was 6 by the riding camp that I work at, and I have wanted to buy him ever since. However, he has some issues that need to be delt with so I am here looking for advice. It doens't matter to me that he may not be perfect, I just want to do whatever I can to make him happier.
In all of the time that I've known him he's had very, very flat feet. His previous owner has just informed me that he's had them all his life. When the stable first purchased him they put him in the pasture with the other 30 horses that they own, and treated him, shoeing wise just like the other animals. They only shoe them in the summer months because they have very intensive riding camps and their hooves wear too fast without them. The other 9 months of the year they are kept barefoot except for a select few who are used for lessons, and tend to be very tender footed. He was left barefoot for several months after he was purchased and he seemed to be ok. He was ouchy and walked like his feet were tender but they were sure it would get better. When it didn't they decided to put shoes and pads on him. These made an enormous difference. He was like a different animal.
Now, 10 years later things are different. He can't be left without shoes at all. He just stands in the pasture with his head down and when he does walk it's very heart wrenching. They currently keep shoes on him all year round and he does fairly well. I think though, that their farrier is pulling the wool over their eyes. He does not like to put pads on horses feet, and after that first summer will not put them back on. I've noticed over the years that even with the shoes on he is still ouchy and tends to not want to move forward.
I have been doing alot of reading on navicular and other foot health related issues. Thanks goodness he doesn't have navicular (hes been checked) but I am still worried about it developing (his flat feet give him heel pain) and I want to know what I can try to make him happy again.
My first step will definately be to get a new farrier. I know, from my friends who own horses, of several good ones. What to do second puts me at a loss. This is why I'm here asking questions.
I know there is a lot of controversy concerning metal shoes and going barefoot. I hear tons of stories about horses with navicular going barefoot and being cured, but I really have to be skeptical. I've seen what he's like barefoot, and not just for a short period of time. I don't know if there is something that I'm missing on the subject but I'm not sure about it. And if he does need shoes, are their certain ones I should consider? Or should mention to my farrier? I read somewhere that metal shoes stop the hoof from expanding and absorbing the concussion like the foot was designed to do which puts more strain on the leg and other joints. If that's true are there certain shoes that maximize or minimize this concussion? What about rubber shoes? or metal shoes with pads.
I'd also like to know if anyone knows about any supliments that will help a horse that could be prone to navicular. Something that will help blood flow and the like. He has good feet otherwise. Ie. has never in all the years I've known him even has one crack, it's just that they are very flat.
This horse loves to run and play, and especially jump and compete. He used to get really excited when he knew he was going to jump and was a real ham at shows. Prancing and showing himself off. He doesn't get excited anymore and I rarely see him run or play on his own free will and he's reluctant to move forward when working. I know he's older, but even now he still never refuses a jump. I really would like to know what I can do to make him happy again. I would much rather have to hold him back from charging the jumps like I used to than to push him on, and I really want him to be able to run and play again. Any feedback would be appreciate. Thanks so much.
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[Dances with Hooves]

"When it didn't they decided to put shoes and pads on him. These made an enormous difference. He was like a different animal.
Now, 10 years later things are different. He can't be left without shoes at all. He just stands in the pasture with his head down and when he does walk it's very heart wrenching. They currently keep shoes on him all year round and he does fairly well. I think though, that their farrier is pulling the wool over their eyes. He does not like to put pads on horses feet, and after that first summer will not put them back on. I've noticed over the years that even with the shoes on he is still ouchy and tends to not want to move forward."

It's nice that he is going to be yours as you will be able to do the things that work for him. If he is more comfortable in a pad you should provide him with same.

"I know there is a lot of controversy concerning metal shoes and going barefoot. I hear tons of stories about horses with navicular going barefoot and being cured, but I really have to be skeptical. I've seen what he's like barefoot, and not just for a short period of time. "

For horses that may have been left long and are experiencing some soft tissue inflamation all that may be needed is a good barefoot trim. Studies done recently however indicate that there is a window of up to 10 or 11 months to begin treatment after symptoms appear that if you hit it the horse can go back to barefoot. Beyond this a host of issues which may include the hoof remodeling to a hard to reverse long toe low heel condition, greater inflamation of tissues, actual damage to structures etc. mean that a lot of these guys with palmer heel pain issues will be happier in a shoe/pad package for the long run.

"I don't know if there is something that I'm missing on the subject but I'm not sure about it. And if he does need shoes, are their certain ones I should consider? Or should mention to my farrier?"

Although there are certain principles of physics that govern whats going to work with these horses I'd suggest that the specific shoe/pad/support material be left to the farrier to choose as different farriers will trained in different product familys.

Couple of concepts that work for me (other folks will add to this thread what works for them) for you to consider. Following a proper trim to the sole plane the horse should have breakover eased with a shoe. Good choices include NB aluminum, Redden 4 point and there are a host of others. The frog should be supported using a wedged frog support pad (provided that hoof testers and the hammer handle test shows that he can tolerate active support) or (if he cant take such support) a hard wedge pad. Under the pad goes EDSS Impression material (if using 4 point shoe the redden Advanced Cushion Support).

Some farriers may use a blunt wedged shoe and fill with a pour in material like equithane. The biomechanics of that are similar to the above and will work too.

" I read somewhere that metal shoes stop the hoof from expanding and absorbing the concussion like the foot was designed to do which puts more strain on the leg and other joints. If that's true are there certain shoes that maximize or minimize this concussion? What about rubber shoes? or metal shoes with pads. "

Well its not necessarily true. Tests done in holland at the university of Utrecht showed that a bare foot landed with a force of about 500 MS/2. Although a steel shoe raised this to 650 MS/2 an aluminum shoe with a urethane pad like the NB frog pad lowered impact to 300 MS/2 so the right shoe and pad exceed barefoot in lowering concussion.

"This horse loves to run and play, and especially jump and compete. He used to get really excited when he knew he was going to jump and was a real ham at shows. Prancing and showing himself off. He doesn't get excited anymore and I rarely see him run or play on his own free will and he's reluctant to move forward when working. I know he's older, but even now he still never refuses a jump. I really would like to know what I can do to make him happy again. I would much rather have to hold him back from charging the jumps like I used to than to push him on, and I really want him to be able to run and play again."

I rehabed a horse named "sid" this past year who had gone a long long time with out treatment. He was a 4 foot hunter till palmer heel pain forced him to retire from lessons at the barn I take lessons at. He turned out to be very comfortable in an aluminum NB shoe and a hard castle 3 degree wedge pad with EDSS impression material. I rode him this summer in 3 hunter paces and we placed in the ribbions at the local circiut of hunter shows in the jumping classes. We shod sid 3 different ways till we found what would work for him so do be prepared to give you farrier some leeway to find what works best for your horse.

Good luck to you. The horse sounds like he is lucky to be getting you as his new owner. Be persistent keep trying and I know you and your new farrier will get him jumping comfortably again soon.

[TE Couch]

Hijacked - George do you have a link for this recent study/ies?
TE

[QUOTE=George_Spear]"For horses that may have been left long and are experiencing some soft tissue inflamation all that may be needed is a good barefoot trim. Studies done recently however indicate that there is a window of up to 10 or 11 months to begin treatment after symptoms appear that if you hit it the horse can go back to barefoot. Beyond this a host of issues which may include the hoof remodeling to a hard to reverse long toe low heel condition, greater inflamation of tissues, actual damage to structures etc. mean that a lot of these guys with palmer heel pain issues will be happier in a shoe/pad package for the long run.

[*Heidiers*]

Thanks so much for the advice. I just have one question though. Someone told me that pads are actually worse than shoes because they cut off the blood flow to the foot even more. Is that true? If I put pads on him will it eventually make him worse in the long run?

[Rick Burten]

Thanks so much for the advice. I just have one question though. Someone told me that pads are actually worse than shoes because they but off the blood flow to the foot even more. Is that true? If I put pads on him will it eventually make him worse in the long run?

In certain instances pads can be a bit constrictive on the sole. That occurs in some thin soled, very flat soled horses because when the package is nailed on, the pad is flush against the sole. In those instances, it is simply a matter of first using a rim pad, then the flat pad. This gives the necessary space to allow correct functioning of the hoof without any impingement.

You will get some advise/opinions that your horse can be left barefoot and in time, will adapt and toughen up. That may or may not be true. In light of the information you have thus far supplied us with, I think that this horse will be best served by using the shoe and pad protocol I outlined above. Additionally, if his frog can handle it, I would use impression material in the rear half of the foot under the pad package. Regardless of whether this is done or not, the full pad that I would use would have additional frog support on its ground surface. In the front part of the hoof I would use a 50/50 mixture of pine tar and venice turpentine with just a little bit of Oakum on top of the mix.

[*Heidiers*]

I just thought you guys would like an update on what I've found out about my quarterhorse's feet. I had another farrier come and do his feet earlier this week and it turns out that the only problems that he had were caused by the wrong trim/shoe size. The shoes that the old farrier had put on him were a size and a half too small, he had just shaped the foot to fit the shoe. And he had placed back shoes on his front feet and trimmed them to fit. Our new farrier fixed the angle of the trim on his feet, and put the right size shoes on him and already (it's only been six days) there is a huge difference. Just yesterday he was ripping and tearing around the pasture just like a yearling. The farrier even says that he has really good feet and can probably go barefoot next winter once he is finished correcting his feet. Thank you for all of your time and advice. I really appreciated it!