Upcoming Meeting with Private Farrier Schools

[Bryan Quinsey]

In previous threads, Rick Burten, CJF, RMF has made reference to an upcoming meeting of the private farrier school owners.

A few weeks ago, Bob Smith, CF owner of the Pacific Coast Horseshoeing School in Sacramento, California called me to advise me that a meeting of the school owners was being planned. Since that time I have talked to other school owners and have confirmed that such a meeting will take place on August 19 & 20 in Oklahoma City.

During a series of phone calls and emails with Mr. Smith, I repeatedly asked if he thought that there would be a chance for me (as the Executive Director of the American Farrier's Association) to receive an invitation to this meeting. An invitation that would allow me to come before the group to make comments about the recent activities of the AFA and to specifically answer their questions. It was made clear that I did not want to be invited as a full participant, but only as a representative of the AFA and then only to answer their questions. I would not want to attend the major portion of their meeting.

I followed this request with a letter to all school operators - both private and public - acknowledging that grievances probably do exist between the educators and the AFA. My message to them was clear - for those past grievances and/or disagreements, I apologize. But for the past I would request that we use it as a foundation upon which we can build a better future for all involved in this industry. I asked that they join me in a pursuit of developing such a positive direction. A direction that would be a win-win situation for all parties.

Last week I received a phone call from Reggie Kester, CJF, owner of the Oklahoma State Horseshoeing School and one of the organizers of the Oklahoma City meeting. He extended to me an invitation to attend the meeting. I respectfully accepted his invitation.

Since then, I have had numerous conversations with members of the AFA Executive Committee and other members regarding this meeting. I would like to take this opportunity to solicit your thoughts on what message that you would like to see me carry to that meeting.

Again, I must reiterate to you:

"My underlying personal goal for that meeting and subsequent meetings regarding this and other issues facing the farrier industry will be one of working in positive directions. I will not point fingers. The past is the past. Today represents the first day of the future. Together let us make the most of the opportunities that lie before us."

I look forward to reading your suggestions. If you'd prefer to call me and discuss this one on one, I'd welcome that too. Thank you.

Bryan

[Phil Armitage]

Bryan, as of now your primary exposure to the farrier trade has been the AFA. I would be wise for you to attend the meeting with an open mind and fists down. Answer there questions, but really take the time to ask questions, listen and seek to understand.

[ray steele]

Bryan

I the spirit of open mindedness, will the AFA open its' membership meeting scheduled for Sept in Omaha to non afa members in the same cordial manner(including giving them a chance to address the sitting body) that the private Farrier schools are showing the AFA?

Regards

Ray Steele

[Bryan Quinsey]

Ray:

Obviously we are a "membership organization". Therefore first right of discussion will go to current AFA members. When all AFA members have been heard on a subject, non-members will be heard. Harrassment, personal attacks, etc. from both members and non-members will not be tolerated. If we truly are a profession - then our meetings will be professional. The AFA's paid-parliamentarian will be in attendance.

The rules of the meeting are simple:

1. Every person who wishes to speak will be given 5 minutes (a parliamentarian with a stop watch will be at the front of the room).
2. After every person who wishes to speak has been heard, then those who have already spoken may speak again.
3. Every person must speak from a microphone.
4. The meeting will be video taped and the meeting transcribed for non attendees to review. If there is a demand, videos of the meeting could also be made available for the cost of production and mailing.

Bryan

[Bryan Quinsey]

Phil:

I would hope that you would have sensed a similar tone/attitude from my original post. It will do no good for me or anyone else to go to that meeting with a hostile attitude. School owners will have grievances. These will be listened to and appropriately addressed. But I want to see the meeting progress from there.

Thanks for the words of encouragement.

Bryan

[Phil Armitage]

Bryan, no I did not sense that at all. But this does not mean anything, just my opinion. I am not convinced (and I do not need to be) that you will go into this meeting without feeling gaurded. This is not your meeting or the AFA's meeting. Nobody is aking for you to handle anything appropriatly. Your already talking like a politician. Go to the meeting, enjoy yourself, relax and listen. I can't say I am sure you will do a good job or I know you will do a good job. All I can do is share how I would attend the meeting. This is their meeting and your invited to attend and I bet their expectations are totaly different than yours. Seek first to understand then to be understood.

The other thing that needs to stop, is pointing out things like this "Harrassment, personal attacks, etc. from both members and non-members will not be tolerated. If we truly are a profession - then our meetings will be professional. The AFA's paid-parliamentarian will be in attendance." This statement shows your gaurd is up. It might get emotional and people will more than likely raise there voices. The best way to handle that is to keep listening the best you can. Don't make accusations or stifle the flow, bring tape recorders, Cam corders if you can, take notes etc. At both the AFA meeting and Private School meeting. Use the information you see and hear to gain a better understanding. Otherwise do not hold meetings or attend meetings if your mind is already made up to do a certain thing. Be open minded.

[Dave Purves]

The other thing that needs to stop, is pointing out things like this "Harrassment, personal attacks, etc. from both members and non-members will not be tolerated. If we truly are a profession - then our meetings will be professional. The AFA's paid-parliamentarian will be in attendance." This statement shows your gaurd is up. It might get emotional and people will more than likely raise there voices. The best way to handle that is to keep listening the best you can. Don't make accusations or stifle the flow, bring tape recorders, Cam corders if you can, take notes etc. At both the AFA meeting and Private School meeting. Use the information you see and hear to gain a better understanding. Otherwise do not hold meetings or attend meetings if your mind is already made up to do a certain thing. Be open minded.

Phil, I can't beleive the hostility you show towards Bryan. He's asked on this open forum for the advise and comments of AFA members and non-members, to take to this educators meeting with him. Doesn't that show you a little bit of what he's about? Obviously you've never met Bryan. And if you think that anything can get accomplished while people are screaming and yelling you don't know much. First, as soon as the first voice is raised, many people will stop listening to the content of said speech, and only listen to the tone. That turns many people off. You know the old saying, when two people are yelling it's hard to tell who the a$$ is. Nothing gets accomplished when emotions get the better of you, and as adults I would hope that a scheduled meeting would be handled appropriately.

Bryan, my question to the school owners would be why was the chapter of educators disbanded, and would it help for them to start it back up, or perhaps start thier own association of farrier educators with thier own representative on the EC, or BOD?
thanks for spending the time Bryan
Dave Purves CF

[Kelly Case]

Bryan,
I am glad to hear that it worked out for you to be present at the school meeting, hopefully we will be able to get some answers and I mean that from both sides the AFA and the schools.
I know that there has been alot of emotional response and heated debate over this, hopefully as things progress starting with this meeting in OKC we can move forward and get back to business.

I look forward to meeting you and I am beliving that this meeting will not only be interesting but also productive.

[Phil Armitage]

Phil, I can't beleive the hostility you show towards Bryan. He's asked on this open forum for the advise and comments of AFA members and non-members, to take to this educators meeting with him. Doesn't that show you a little bit of what he's about? Obviously you've never met Bryan. And if you think that anything can get accomplished while people are screaming and yelling you don't know much. First, as soon as the first voice is raised, many people will stop listening to the content of said speech, and only listen to the tone. That turns many people off. You know the old saying, when two people are yelling it's hard to tell who the a$$ is. Nothing gets accomplished when emotions get the better of you, and as adults I would hope that a scheduled meeting would be handled appropriately.

Bryan, my question to the school owners would be why was the chapter of educators disbanded, and would it help for them to start it back up, or perhaps start thier own association of farrier educators with thier own representative on the EC, or BOD?
thanks for spending the time Bryan
Dave Purves CF

Dave, I am not being hostile to Brian he asked for advice and I gave it. I still detect a controlling tone in his message, I may be off the mark as you detected hostility in my message. I have been in more meetings, debates, negotiations, working groups, problem solveing than I care to mention. One thing I learned as with horses, sometimes you have to back off and let things happen, but observing and listening with empathy and it will settle allot quicker. Start trying to stifle something too soon and it will get out of hand or people will just walk away because they will feel there not being heard and the whole thing is a waste of time. I suggest hireing a professional moderator that has no opionion either way. I am not for hire, I have strong opinions on this issue. Timeing is everything, it comes from the Seek to understand first and then to be understood.

Inorder to be empathetic you need to gain a very good appreciation and understanding of what is important to farriers and the schools.

I do not have ideas for him to take to the meeting with him, however his demeanor while attending is probably the single most important thing to be aware of. Ever play Poker Dave, body lanquage and facial expressions are very important. Your right I do not know Brian at all, tell me how his demeanor is.

[ray steele]

Bryan,

i feel the need to ask more directly . Is the general membership meeting open to non afa members? The reason that I ask in this way is because it is clearly stated on the afa calender of events that the 9/9/05 general membership meeting is a ( open forum open to afa members only!)
There is no mention of openness to the 9/10/05 bod meeting.

I'd hate to see someone spend the time and money to show up and be told to go away.
I guess a simple yes or no to the question will suffice

Regards

Ray Steele

[Bryan Quinsey]

Ray:

I have adjusted the AFA's Calendar of Events to reflect that priority for speaking at the Open Forum AFA Membership Meeting will be given to AFA members in good standing. Non-members will be given the time to speak only after all AFA members have been heard from.

Bryan

[Bryan Quinsey]

Phil & Dave:

I too am not sensing hostility in Phil's response. I asked for your input on this meeting and am willing to listen to all that respond. I must tell you that prior to being hired as Executive Director I was employed in economic development. I have been the lead person for a number of multi-million dollar projects that included federal legislators, state governors and legislators, as well as some of the largest corporations in the world. Negotiating with these entities often proved to be difficult, but in the end it was gratifying to learn that we had received the nod and that a company would announce that they planned to build a project in our state or community that would invest $ into our economy and employ "x" number of our citizens.

One of the keys to negotiating these projects was being able to listen and to reiterate what I had heard to the elected officials that were responsible for authorizing the deal that I had structured with the company. I assure you that I will be listening to the grievances of the school owners. I want to make sure that they feel that having an audience with me will be productive. I want to be able to convey their message to the leadership of the AFA (i.e. the AFA Board of Directors).

When I talked about "harassment" in my original post I had just read the rules that Baron has established for posting in this forum:

"The rules for this forum are simple:

1) The Farrier & Hoofcare Resource Center does not condone harassment in any form. Posts which harass other members will be deleted. Any member who targets another member specifically to cause him/her distress, embarrassment, unwanted attention or other discomfort is guilty of harassment.

2) You may have a disagreement with someone's point of view, and that's good, because we encourage lively discussions on these forums. But personal attacks, or attacks based on a person's race, national origin, ethnicity, religion or gender, are strictly prohibited. When you have a disagreement with someone's opinion or point of view, address the subject, don't attack the person.

3) Members are requested to refrain from posting any unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, defamatory, vulgar, obscene, profane, hateful, racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable material of any kind. Posts containing any of the forgoing will be deleted, and a member who persists will be banned."

Again, your input is appreciated.

Bryan

[ray steele]

Bryan,

Thank you for answering and clearing this up for me. I am taking it on your word that non afa members will be allowed to attend, even though they may not speak due to time constraints. If this is not the case please inform me/us.
Thanks again,
Regards

Ray Steele

[Bryan Quinsey]

Ray:

You have it correct.

Bryan