Abscess?

[kclifton]

My 6yr old QH mare started showing mild lameness 3 weeks ago. She has very flat feet and she is a very heavy muscled mare. I found a major crack in the center of the hoof going upwards about 2 inches. Farrier came out trimmed her said he felt certian that was the problem. The lameness has increased. When standing she points the toe and spends time in the pond.
I used hoof testers and found a ouchy spot on the sole, just to the outside of the point of the frog, but close to the white line.
Use a hoof knife and dug small hole, very shallow and blood went everywhere.
It was not old blood, but bright red. It continued to bleed out for some time. When I opened the hole a little wider, it led to the crack on the hoof wall. There I found a second pocket of blood.
The mare is much relieved, but what is going on? It was not the normal type of abscess.

[cynthia-jay]

It sounds like a blood bruise and by letting the pressure off as you did allowed it to relieve the pressure.
Keep it clean and dry and call your Farrier.
It may need attentioon by a Vet as well.
best, as always,
Jay

[kclifton]

Will do!
Thank you!

[calshoer]

WhyohWhy some folks think they can go digging holes in the soles of sore., flat footed horses is beyond me.
Blood briuse???....what is the heck is that ? It sounds like one of the bad farrier's excuses I was taught to use back in school for when you draw blood accidentaly when you didn't check first to see WHAT you were trimming through .
Given that it bled fresh like that You may have well opened a hole through the live sole into the sole corium ,protentially exposing the coffin bone to an infection. .
Your horse fits the scenario of a low grade laminitis/ chronic founder and that should ALWAYS be either determined or ruled out with XRAYS before any trimming is done. If the coffin bone has been slowly sinking for any reason, there could be very little sole underneath it. (Flat feet) I have seen those flat footed ones paper thin, so of course they bruise easily , but digging around withuot more information is NOT the answer.
. I even knew a young veterinarian who almost killed one doing that very thing without first getting Xrays to determine how much sole there was.She thought it was a bad briuse because it didn't present in the classic founder stance and was clinically worse in one foot.
It took months to remedy the resulting trauma to the coffin bone.
CALL A VET. And in the meantime get the feet w****d up well padded in a clean dry place. Patty

[danverschild]

Patty,
Not that you need support on this, but AMEN!

[cynthia-jay]

Accidently pricking a horse and bleeding is different than a blood bruise:

In the event the horse was foundering, by bleeding them almost untill they faint is an old practice here and it works
It isn't the best way but there is a Vet here that performs it.

Advised to keep it clean and dry and call a Farrier and Vet for further consultation.

The horse may require a medical plate and or/wrqapping /corrective shoeing, antibiotics among other medications and care.

best, as always,
Jay

A horse can loose up to a gallon of blood before there are any noticeable problems

[kclifton]

Thank you for the information.
I failed to mention that after digging the hole in the sole, I filled the hole with betadaine solution. Wrapped the hoof with a diaper,vetwrap, duct taped the the edges. Gave her a tetanus antitoxin and antibiotics.
I change her wrap everyday and retreat with iodine/betadine, but I do not reopen the wound. Her lameness has decreased.
As for laminitis or founder - I realize it can happen with out one ever knowing, but she hasn't been ridden in over a year, she is on the same pasture she has been on her entire life (greenfield bermuda grass) and receives no grain, just free choice minerals and salt.
She is not obese - but she is an easy keeper.
I wish I had a vet nearby, but I don't. She will have to tolerate a 6 hour trailer ride to the nearest vet with an x-ray machine.

[calshoer]

Cynthia Jay, since you state that a blood bruise is different than accidentally trimming too close (pricking) expalin then WHAT exactly is your definition of a "blood bruise"?. (I have a hunch you mean a "hematoma", the proper term for a pool of blood from a bad bruise ) but I want to hear your definition to insure that is what you mean.
As well, if there is really a vet out there who actually thinks that you should treat founder by 'bleeding' them he should probably lose his license for practicing in the dark ages.
Laminitis in the modern horse comes from a lot more complicated cause(s) than simply pressure in the foot from blood.
PS are you a full time farrier? If not ,what is your experience and expertise?
Patty

[cynthia-jay]

It is exactly what I mean...hematobia...by blood bruise...
Yes i am a fulltime Farrier, trainer and Breeder including being a hoofaholic and horseaholic...
As for the Vet that includes this method in his practice I do not use or recomend this individual,
I intended to put the mind of the individual at rest in their quest and as for founder or laminitis this didn't seem to be the case here .
I also have my own equine lameness consulting business and am speciality cases only
as ever, Cynthia Jay
Ps I find you rude and obnoxious in your replies at times and question your credentials as to what kind of Farrier you are. I refuse to get into a mind picking match with you

[calshoer]

Well pretty much anyone one wh ohas been here for years can attest to my experience and credentials,and a lot of them have met me personally.

And I choose to use my real name instead of a pseudonym so folks can look me up if they want. I have given out my history and credential when questioned on the old Bulletin boards several times in the past.
Yes I sure can be rude, (actually more like harsh), when I think a horse's welfare may be at stake. And telling someone that is is OK to draw fresh blood in a case where there is no diagnosis and potentially thin sole thickness is very,very dangerous.
And you reference the fact that it is OK because one vet you know does it but then turn around and say you do not use or recomend this vet. ????

As to the possibility of laminitis,from the information in the post this horse does CLEARLY fit several criteria of a potential low grade chronic laminitic even though she is only six. (flat feet, "heavy muscled", standing in the pond for relief, and living out on pasture ) In other words, a chronically fat broodmare type who is prone to wet soft feet and founder. I treat foundered horses almost every week. I know the types well.
Patty .

[kclifton]

Thany you cynthia-jay for being kind and trying to make me feel more at ease with my mare's situation. (and mine as well - no one wants to be responsible for ruining their horses feet)
To report in, it was a week today that I opened the "abscess" and now my mare is running with the rest of her buddies. At a walk on hard ground, no lameness. At a trot, slight head bob. The wound has dried out completly and it is very obvious that there was a connection between the abscess and the crack in the hoof wall. Hematoma would be a safe guess I suppose.

Patty I appreciate your information. But I feel like you did indeed present it in a harsh manner. I am not your average "******" horse owner. Maybe I was quick in my actions with my mare, but feeling very certian that I was not dealing with a founder situation, I felt that looking for and opening what I believed to be an abscess was the right action to take.
The mare had no heat in any leg or hoof. There was no detectable digital pulse. Just a single sore spot in the sole of the hoof near the crack in the hoof wall.

[cynthia-jay]

"You catch more flies with honey than vinager"

You did a good job on the mare as I followed your reply.

A slight imbalance may have caused the bruising and the crack ...or a stone bruise .You may want to rocker the toe to unload it and keep an eye on it and check for a balance problem.
best of luck to you and thank you for the reply.
as ever,
Jay