Posted by Patty Stiller on June 15, 2004 at 21:35:11:
In Reply to: Re: Strasser Method Question?/ Navicular posted by Tracy Raffaele on June 07, 2004 at 22:30:32:
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: : : : Of course you would not apply the Strasser Method to your show Saddlebreds and Hackney ponies! You are choosing man's idea over nature / evolution - that is fine for you - the method is good for all horses but not all horse owners
: : I'd be willing to wager that were you able to poll those horses that became room temperature after the Strasser Method was inflicted on them, you'd find that they felt the method was not good for them. Further, were you able to poll those horses who ended up in more pain, with more suffering, butchered feet, ad nasuem, I think you'd find that they didn't think the method was good for them. Ergo, your opinion that (with regard to horses)"the method is good for all horses" is pure nonsense. Which, when you think about it, sums up the Strasser Method(of Applied Hoof Butchery) quite succintly.
: Judging by the amount of licking and chewing that goes on while I trim I'd say that on the whole most horses are very happy with their feet. Some even let me know that i need to take off a couple of more mm by their action.
Well as soon as I remove any really crappy shoeing and begin to do ANY trim,removing underrun hels and bent bars, the also lick and chew. it is the removing iof deformed hoof that gives them the relief.It is not necessary to keep going then and butcher the foot beyond removing the deformed parts. Strasser trimming is certainly not the only route to getting a horse relief from sore feet(which brings up yet another contradiction....how could he have been in discomfort, needing relief, if the shoes numbed him....? ) The point is that doing *anything* other than some of the truly piss poor shoeings I have seen as the "before"pictures on the Strasser Bulletin Boards will allow the horse relief and get them to lick and chew. I see the same reaction when I go out to see a very sore barefooted horse and I nail on a properly fitted shoe and give him relief. Patty
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: : - by the way Dr. Redden states that the correct coronet hairline angle is about 30 degrees. You can read Dr Redden's "wild horse" study on nanric.com - quite interesting.
: : Hmmm. "about thirty degrees". Not exactly thirty degrees, not always thirty degrees, not "every" equid. Could be higher, could be lower(rarely).
: : Philosophically and perhaps rhetorically, how do we know that what Dr. Redden states is correct?
Actually I saw that study when it was first presented at laminitis symposium, and have also read it a couple of times.No where does Dr.Redden state that the 30 degrees he found on that batch of feral horses is the "correct" hairline angle for every horse. He simply recorded the hoof parameters he found for that particular group of horses. AS well the radiographs were taken with the horses in recumbancy, non weight bearing. Given that it is well duocumented that frog support changes coffin joint alignment,that could be a real factor in the rue weight bearing angles of hte bones. Support through the digital cushion could effect the coffin bone angles,raising them. And no studies yet that I have ever seen or heard of has compared recumbant coffin bone angles to those in the same horses standing . Therefore only a radiographic study in a large number live feral horses from varying herds, taken STANDING, with both feet equally weight bearing could be considered a decent sample of faeral coffin bone angles. AS well,farriers and trimmers are not dealing with mainly feral horses. We are charged with maintaining man made horses produced from man made selective breeding.
Also, assuming that he stated that 30 degrees is "correct" contradicts his own policy of raising heels in some therapeutic situations so it would't make sense. TE I find it interesting that just like Dr. Strasser you choose to use only little parts of some people's work to try to justify the unjustifiable, while conveniently ignoring the rest of their body of work. Patty
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: You think that somehow the basic skeletal structure has been change enough through a mere few 1000 yrs of breeding to justify what you do. Vet. textbooks show a ground parallel coffin bone in the skeletal pictures. Some how this fact gets lost along the way.
And at one time maps showed a flat earth too. That changed. Patty